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Grobe to Baylor

coredeac said:
I may not. But, this isn't on me. This rests squarely with Jim Grobe. The ball and millions of dollars were in his court. Not mine.
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Grobe performed unheard of miracles from 2006 thru 2008. What he accomplished during those three years had never happened before at WF and will never happen again. Unfortunately, the downside to that success is that it has evidently separated WF fans' future expectations from reality. Neither Grobe nor anyone else can ever hope to duplicate what he did during those three years....even if they worked 28 hours a day, 8 days a week.
 
bobknightfan said:
Grobe performed unheard of miracles from 2006 thru 2008. What he accomplished during those three years had never happened before at WF and will never happen again. Unfortunately, the downside to that success is that it has evidently separated WF fans' future expectations from reality. Neither Grobe nor anyone else can ever hope to duplicate what he did during those three years....even if they worked 28 hours a day, 8 days a week.
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I have no unrealistic expectations of the future. I also don't whitewash the past.
 
coredeac said:
I have no unrealistic expectations of the future. I also don't whitewash the past.
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Are you sure about that? You have insinuated that Grobe "quit" toward the end of his career at WF. The fact is, though, that his teams only "receded to the all-time WF norm" during that time from earlier unsustainable successes. Let's look at the facts:

Grobe's record during his last three years at WF was 15-22, a winning percentage of 40.5%. Wake Forest has been playing football for 109 years now. The school's all-time record is 425 wins, 638 losses & 31 ties.....a winning percentage of 40.3%. And even during those last three years when you have hinted that Grobe "quit", his teams still had more success than almost all other WF coaches have had in the last 60 years since the ACC began. Here are the overall winning percentages for all other WF football coaches in the last 60 years:

Paul Amen - 31.3%
Billy Hildebrand - 17.5%
Bill Tate - 35.5%
Cal Stoll - 46.9%
Tom Harper - 18.2%
Chuck Mills - 20.9%
John Mackovic - 41.2%
Al Groh - 39.4%
Bill Dooley - 44.8%
Jim Caldwell - 29.2%
Dave Clawson - 25.0%
 
coredeac said:
I may not. But, this isn't on me. This rests squarely with Jim Grobe. The ball and millions of dollars were in his court. Not mine.
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It also rests on the shoulders of Ron Well-Man who did not have the balls to make Jim Grobe change up his staff and get out on the recruiting trail after the contract Well-Man gave Grobe all those millions from the incentives of the Atlantic Coast Conference title. Well-Man was afraid he was going to lose him and would not put pressure on him then it was too late and the Deacons were stuck a predominantly lazy staff led by a golf playing head coach. That is the reason Coach Dave Clawson was left in the position he was in to have to start all over from the ground up and rebuild this mess one block and blocker at a time.
 
bobknightfan said:
Well, you will never see anyone remotely close to Grobe's equal at WF again.

Clawson is drawing an enormous salary, too....and going into his 3rd year he has yet to have a WF team that has even scored a touchdown in a conference win. I don't think that has ever happened before with a P-5 conference team.....zero touchdowns over a 2-year period in conference wins. Wake is 2-15 against conference teams so far under Clawson....and probably should be 0-17. They didn't score a single point in regulation against Virginia Tech and BC couldn't even get a play off in the last 20 seconds from the 1-yard line in a 3-0 game. That's even worse than Bzzdelik.

As one of the tags pointed out, Grobe's worst year at WF was better than Clawson's best year at WF....but maybe Clawson's 3rd year will be the charm. He certainly has a shitty-enough schedule to win some games this year.....home games against Tulane, Delaware, Army and the other three worst teams in the conference.
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Biggest I'm-a-dumbass what-the-fuck stat ever. We have two ACC wins in two years. That's your sample size. And ignores the TDs we've scored in losses. When we win a game and a score a TD, are you gonna come on here and eat your own shit? Very doubtful.
 
Yeah. Bob doesn't use the same logic for the 2006 ACC Champsionship Game.

It's the lack of scoring and production across the board that is problematic. Winning is winning though. I'll take 9-6, 6-3, or 3-0 scores if that's how they come.
 
I think all he's saying is that we haven't stomped anybody in the ACC yet. I hope that changes Sept. 10th.
 
Bones McKinney said:
It also rests on the shoulders of Ron Well-Man who did not have the balls to make Jim Grobe change up his staff and get out on the recruiting trail after the contract Well-Man gave Grobe all those millions from the incentives of the Atlantic Coast Conference title. Well-Man was afraid he was going to lose him and would not put pressure on him then it was too late and the Deacons were stuck a predominantly lazy staff led by a golf playing head coach. That is the reason Coach Dave Clawson was left in the position he was in to have to start all over from the ground up and rebuild this mess one block and blocker at a time.
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No disagreement with this assertion. There was plenty of blame to pass around.
 
Grobe:

2001 - great year complete new energy
2002 - bowl win - very good
2003 - not good
2004 - not good
2005 - glimpses, iirc, but still not good
2006 - terrific
2007 - very good
2008 - very good
2009 - good team, close, no bowl
2010 - not good
2011 - a 25 yard field goal from another ACCCG
2012 - not good
2013 - not good, but despite what some think, he was trying and exasperated is how he looked and sounded in that final post game, did not give up, just ended on a low note

That is 7 good or quality years and 6 not good or worse.

Clawson is 2 out of 2 awful. Hopefully, this is the year. I DO like our defense, just need a little depth. We can get 5-6 wins with this defense.
 
Complacent Deac said:
Grobe:

2001 - great year complete new energy
2002 - bowl win - very good
2003 - not good
2004 - not good
2005 - glimpses, iirc, but still not good
2006 - terrific
2007 - very good
2008 - very good
2009 - good team, close, no bowl
2010 - not good
2011 - a 25 yard field goal from another ACCCG
2012 - not good
2013 - not good, but despite what some think, he was trying and exasperated is how he looked and sounded in that final post game, did not give up, just ended on a low note

That is 7 good or quality years and 6 not good or worse.

Clawson is 2 out of 2 awful. Hopefully, this is the year. I DO like our defense, just need a little depth. We can get 5-6 wins with this defense.
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Nick Saban wouldn't have done much with the roster Grobe left. Maybe Clawson should have done more, but he gets a pass from me those first two years. Significant improvement expected this year.
 
Buttermaker said:
Nick Saban wouldn't have done much with the roster Grobe left. Maybe Clawson should have done more, but he gets a pass from me those first two years. Significant improvement expected this year.
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Well, he certainly has the schedule for it. Other than Clemson, he has about the weakest 6 home games he could possibly schedule. Tulane, Delaware & Army couldn't beat the Weak Sisters of the Poor and.... considering the other three games have to be conference opponents....Virginia, Boston College & Syracuse are probably the three worst teams in the ACC (not counting WF, of course....and there is no way for Clawson to schedule a game against them).

I don't know how many games Clawson will win this year, but any talk about "significant improvement" should take into consideration that unbelievably crappy home schedule. Winning even one conference game on the road would be a far greater achievement than winning all six of those home games.
 
Grobe left the program in worse shape than he found it. It's hard to do that as a Wake coach.

He's like a guy who took $1000 to Atlantic City, decided not to cash out when he hit $100,000, and then went home with nothing but the shirt on his back.
 
I think Duke might be more realistic. If Sirk can't go (still no full-contact practices) sounds like Cut might go with a RSFr. at QB, so it would be that guy's first real action
 
wsc8521s said:
I think Duke might be more realistic. If Sirk can't go (still no full-contact practices) sounds like Cut might go with a RSFr. at QB, so it would be that guy's first real action
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I thought Parker Boehme was the backup? He's a RSJr.
 
He was running third team in Duke's scrimmage. Barely got on the field
 
PhDeac said:
Grobe left the program in worse shape than he found it. It's hard to do that as a Wake coach.

He's like a guy who took $1000 to Atlantic City, decided not to cash out when he hit $100,000, and then went home with nothing but the shirt on his back.
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While technically true in terms in talent (but not profile), that statement isn't really valid because he alone recruited and coached the team with the greatest season in WF history (2006) and the greatest run of seasons in WF history (it's not like he won with another coach's talent). So, had he left WF in 2006 or any year until his last one (or possibly two), he would've left the program in far better shape. Coaching football, particularly at WF requires max effort, and Grobe's effort slacked at the end. Not the first coach to ever have that happen.

BTW, I had written off Baylor's 2016 season as a disaster (and still think that potential exists because they have lost a ton of depth), but many in the know are convinced that Baylor's starting talent remains national championship level. Also, their schedule is weak (as always), and while this boggles my mind, Briles son remains the Baylor OC (they also kept their DC); so Baylor is going to run the same system that led them to kick arse over the last few years. They will be heavy favorites in every game until at least late October; so, don't be surprised if Old Grobie is in the thick of the championship mix.
 
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