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Official 2023-24 NBA Season Thread - Thunder/Mavs Game 6

IAppreciateIt said:
ppg in a vacuum when it comes to evaluating individual players, which i do think is heavily related to roster construction though
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Agreed. In the right system (think nba all stars) I could be a greater than 0 ppg scorer. I'll die on this hill.
 
IAppreciateIt said:
i've occasionally ranted about this, but ppg is so overrated. these teams with great individual scorers who just alternate possessions where they get to run the offense kind of defeats the purpose since you have a limited number of possessions.

thinking basketball did an interesting piece on luka that touches on it a bit, and the ineffectivess of him and kyrie taking turns with the offense.

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Apetit, first thanks for posting. I had many thoughts, then decided I should watch first, and then admittedly only got through half of the vid because it was only confirming some of my frustrations. So feel free to point me back to video for stuff I might have missed

Not saying this is you, because you watch a lot of basketball, but

1. I feel like people who just say they take turns running the offense don’t really watch Mavs games. I think it was certainly true last year when they were feeling themselves out post trade. But I think the offense is way more dynamic than taking turns at this point. They have worked far more into the offense to get all involved while also making sure both get their touches

2. He brought up the plus minus with Luka on and off the floor. To me that is easily understood by the fact that the Mavs have never had a great team around Luka. They would be a lotto team without him. The video states the on off stats show how great players make good teams great. The problem is Luka makes bad teams good/great. This is different if his team was great. (And I haven’t heard anyone argue that this current Mavs team isn’t the best roster Luka has had)

3. The heliocentric thing to me is a tired argument. Mostly again because of the roster. Luka isn’t heliocentric on his national team where there are guys that fit a specific style of play. Furthermore Lukas heliocentric style has gone down since the Mavs added other players who can actually dribble or not just stand somewhere and shoot. Mavs WCF run always had 2 ball handlers on the floor for this reason and this current roster is similar

(I think this is also highlighted by Mavs being top 10 in pace this year after bottom of NBA last few years. They actually have athletes and guys who can dribble now)

4. Luka is also the most blitzed player in the NBA. Which means he puts up his numbers in spite of that. And this also proves teams often dare the rest of the Mavs to beat them, which they often do not without Luka’s brilliance

5. Finally and most importantly Luka has definite faults. And this is part of what drives me craziest about this videos argument. Luka to me is bubble Jokic. Luka has to decide if he wants to commit to being a respectable two way player, to being in peak athletic shape, and if he wants to commit to basketball as a job and not just something he has fun with. Jokic turned himself and the Nuggets around when he did this. Luka and the Mavs are a much better team when Luka takes defense and his physical shape seriously, when he doesn’t waste possessions whining or catching his breath.
 
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On another note, Ant is the real and if I was the Minnesota GM I build around Ant and Gobert and find a way to ship KAT for stuff
 
DeacdeTejas said:
On another note, Ant is the real and if I was the Minnesota GM I build around Ant and Gobert and find a way to ship KAT for stuff
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Stuff like what? KAT seems fine as a 2nd or 3rd option. 2024 is their first rounder until 2028. So they're pretty locked into this lineup. Banking on Ant's development, McDaniels making a leap, and maybe Leonard Miller becoming a rotation big wing seems like a better bet. After that, just keep and sign solid role players around the core.
 
PhDeac said:
Stuff like what? KAT seems fine as a 2nd or 3rd option. 2024 is their first rounder until 2028. So they're pretty locked into this lineup. Banking on Ant's development, McDaniels making a leap, and maybe Leonard Miller becoming a rotation big wing seems like a better bet. After that, just keep and sign solid role players around the core.
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The what is a fair question. I just don’t see KAT working out well long term between the injuries and Ant taking over team

But you’re right, grass may not be greener
 
Ant and KAT seem to have good rapport and KAT seems to be fine not being #2 to Ant on offense

I find both KAT and Gobert annoying individually as people, but think they've got a good thing going and I would not move KAT rith now
 
I don’t think they could get good value for KAT. He’s a very good player big he’s not a guy and he’s an injury risk.

It’s weird to say with Ant so young but they’re in win now mode until KAT and Gobert are washed. They’ve got an ascendant star, a good core, good vet role players, and promising young players.
 
Consensus seeming to form already that Lebron will opt out this summer. That should be fun.
 
And reports coming out that the Lakers are willing to draft Bronny.
 
PhDeac said:
And reports coming out that the Lakers are willing to draft Bronny.
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It's not like they're going to contend anytime in the next few years, so it would be very smart for the Lakers to lock down the Lebron retirement tour whether it's next season or the following one or whatever. They'd make sooo much money.

I'd be kind of annoyed if I was a Lakers fan having to wait for the next phase of the franchise to get started, but if any fanbase doesn't have a right to bitch about being uncompetitive for a few seasons it's them.
 
I saw a meme that had Lebron in a Cavs uniform and KD in a OKC uniform. Gotta admit both make a ton of sense.

KD wouldn't be the best player for the Thunder and they need a big wing. Lebron could slot in at the 3 and have plenty of talent to play off of.
 
I don't get how people can see stuff like the environment at the garden tonight and still not like the NBA
 
They don't play defense. And you know how much people revere defense.
 
PhDeac said:
They don't play defense. And you know how much people revere defense.
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And 9 times out of 10 they're really stretching to draw some comparison to the NHL and toughness or something, which just feels like there's something else they want to say but can't
 
For the Thunder? Yeah, they could go either way. For KD? Makes a bunch of sense.
 
rawarr said:
I generally dislike the giant market teams that get so much media love, but the Knicks being good lives up to the hype.
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That shot of all the celebrities in MSG took me out of my happiness for likable Knicks players.
 
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