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So the Pub strategy is to hold the nation and economy hostage?

WakeandBake

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...to get the budget cuts Americans don't want?

Am I understanding this correctly? They are going to push the US to the brink of another economic collapse and her first credit default in history to make a point about cutting medicare?

Is this a sound political strategy for 2012? is it sound government policy for America?

wtf?
 
Wait, Americans don't want budget cuts?
 
Americans don't want to kill Medicare to give the rich huge tax cuts. That's for sure.

In fact why don't make it a simple referendum. Winner take all:

If you want to kill Medicare with vouchers that don't guarantee you'll have to pay for insurance and you want to cut taxes on the Top 1% by 30% you vote Republican.

If you donm't you vote Dem.

Who do you think would win?

If the Dems have ANY brains that's the simple ad they will run in every district and nationally.
 
They don't want a cut in their services, no. Do you follow politics/government closely at all Go? That's been the dilemma - Americans want lots of gov services and low taxes, and now we are in debt.

These tea party assholes hold some sway now with their freshmen congressmen and Bohner is playing along. This is nonsense. Raise the debt limit and make some reasonable cuts in defense and medicare - and raise the fucking taxes on the highest earners. That drivel about the top 10% paying 40% of the taxes or whatever is meaningless - they have all the money that's why they pay all the taxes. They reaped the greatest benefit ($$) from the debt-fueled expansion - they need to pay a few more percentage points in taxes. Its not a job killer - that's steaming load that is fed to the masses.
 
You do realize I hope that if you take the top rate to 100% and really stick it to those rich guys the budget deficit for this year alone would still exceed $1 trillion?

Socking it to the "rich" alone ain't gonna get us out of this financial cluster fuck.

Our entitlement programs are collapsing under their own weight. Total overhauls have to occur. Demographics alone make SS and Medicare unsustainable.

Taxing the "rich" and nibbling around the edges of the budget isn't going to get it done.

Is the Left's solution to fixing these entitlement programs to do nothing? Or to make only small token changes? If so grandma and grandpa better get ready for some rough seas ahead because the funds needed to support these programs aren't there. Fix them now or face severe austerity in the next 10-20 years.
 
Just one other question...please define "rich"?
 
Bush's tax cuts have cost us over $3T out of our national debt of $14T. It's pure insanity to continue them at all.

Other than the immoral war in Iraq, Ryan's plan for Medicare that the House voted for in over thirty years. There isn't a close second.
 
Tax cuts don't cost anything. Not collecting revenue is not an expense.

Not having the testicular fortitude to cut spending when you reduce revenue collections is the problem and why we have runaway spending.

Revenue reductions are never considered to be expenditures...unless you're in the fantasy world of national politics.
 
Obama's had 2+ years to end the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan...why hasn't he?
 
You do realize I hope that if you take the top rate to 100% and really stick it to those rich guys the budget deficit for this year alone would still exceed $1 trillion

link please. didn't we go through this on the old board?
 
Tax cuts don't cost anything. Not collecting revenue is not an expense.

Not having the testicular fortitude to cut spending when you reduce revenue collections is the problem and why we have runaway spending.

Revenue reductions are never considered to be expenditures...unless you're in the fantasy world of national politics.

what are you gonna cut?

is it responsible to threaten to default to get this done?
 
The default will come naturally. They are not threatening it, they are warning about it. Big difference.
 
raise the fucking debt limit, then work out reasonable measures to lower deficits and debt over time.

this is political douchbaggery.
 
link please. didn't we go through this on the old board?

Yes we did...and a 100% tax rate on the top 2% rather than 36.5% would generate a total of $1.4 trillion. That's total...not in addtion to what they already pay.
 
Yes we did...and a 100% tax rate on the top 2% rather than 36.5% would generate a total of $1.4 trillion. That's total...not in addtion to what they already pay.

can you hook me with a link to where you go that? thanks

I never called for tax hikes to fix the problem in one year. It took many many years for the tax breaks not jibing with expenditures to get us here.
 
No political douchebaggery is kicking the can down the road rather than sacking up and dealing with the pile of shit now.

Continuing to borrow while only cutting chump change here and there is what's totally irresponsible.

Greece...Ireland...Portugal...you'd think we'd have learned something by now.
 
raise the fucking debt limit, then work out reasonable measures to lower deficits and debt over time.

this is political douchbaggery.

More debt only makes the problem worse in the eyes of those who eventually have to pay it back. We've hit a crossroads, and their position now is "Listen, we've told you this for years and yet you don't listen because it isn't your money and you're not the one who is going to have to pay it back. So, guess what, either do it our way or fuck you, let it crash, we don't give a damn. If that is the game of chicken that you want to play with our money, fine, we'll play it. After your system crashes on itself, we'll still have enough money to live on and you'll be eating dirt and leaves." Obviously that is an extremely harsh position, but it looks like where we are headed given the events of recent years. We are going to have very real class warfare unless major changes are made in the near future.
 
No political douchebaggery is kicking the can down the road rather than sacking up and dealing with the pile of shit now.

Continuing to borrow while only cutting chump change here and there is what's totally irresponsible.

Greece...Ireland...Portugal...you'd think we'd have learned something by now.

god that kicking the can down the road metaphor is so fucking overused nowadays - please stop using it.

You don't hold the US credit rating hostage to make budget changes, you just don't do it. it is a desperate political move and you know it. We are slowly emerging from an economic meltdown, and you want to go addressing huge changes while the economy is fragile and tenuous. Let's raise the debt ceiling and make these changes gradually while we are standing on firmer ground.

I heard Bohner say on Sunday that "small businesses are reluctant to hire and expand because of government borrowing." Does he think we believe that shit? Every small business owner I know expands and hires when they are selling. Every proposal I have heard from the right since the '08 collapse would do nothing to increase economic activity but would stifle it. Some wanted to lets banks collapse. Some wanted to slash all government spending and did. Look at the states, their broke and laying off workers. This leads to slower recovery. it's ludicrous.

Raise the fucking debt limit. The deficit hysteria has traction because the right has nothing else on Obama, nothing to vilify him on - no scandals, the wars rage on, everyone has their guns....they have nothing so they are pouncing on this to our own detriment - and you guys are lapping it up like little puppies.
 
More debt only makes the problem worse in the eyes of those who eventually have to pay it back. We've hit a crossroads, and their position now is "Listen, we've told you this for years and yet you don't listen because it isn't your money and you're not the one who is going to have to pay it back. So, guess what, either do it our way or fuck you, let it crash, we don't give a damn. If that is the game of chicken that you want to play with our money, fine, we'll play it. After your system crashes on itself, we'll still have enough money to live on and you'll be eating dirt and leaves." Obviously that is an extremely harsh position, but it looks like where we are headed given the events of recent years. We are going to have very real class warfare unless major changes are made in the near future.

who is saying this? the wealthy? are you serious?

they wealthy have expanded their fortunes on this debt-fueled expansion of the past 30 some odd years, now you think they are saying "we told you so.." are you drunk?

what they are saying is: yeah - lets put it on the backs of the elderly and poor so we can protect our fortunes. That's what they're saying
 
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