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What if US went to war with China?

DeacWatcher

Ricky Peral
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Hypothetical of course but is there any way around this scenario?

Answer: China would win.

Explanation: China would open by selling all its US treasurys. The US would have to either default or print money. Either way there would be an economic blow that would destabilize the american economy and eliminate the ability of the USA to borrow money (at any reasonable interest rate). Therefore, financial security and military security are now equally relevant. Only Germany and China seem to understand this.
 
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We could do a sneak attack by sending a commando team of Seal Team Six along with Sylvester Stallone and wipe out their national bank before that happens. Then we lob tactical nukes onto their major cities while unleashing hell over the internet in the form of a virus that secretly dumps pictures of a spread-eagled naked Kathy Griffin yelling obscenities in Mandarin at each PC user. I think we win bro. Team USA FUCK YEAH!!!!
 
China doesn't own nearly as much US debt as the populist belief.

Also, how about the fact that China's economy is almost entirely dependent on US consumer spending? We would open by shutting down trade with China, which would hurt us, but would absolutely cripple China.

We could damage China way more economically than China could damage us.
 
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If China unloaded all US holdings as their first act of aggression, they'd effectively be declaring war against most of the world.
 
China would lose. We're their biggest trading partner.
 
Who's invading who?

One of the upsides of economic globalization is that superpower war isn't really possible without devastating both country's economies too much to make it worthwhile.

And it's not like either country could invade the other. What would the fight be over, exactly?
 
The Chinese dumping our debt would be the quickest way to create a revolution in their own country. The resulting unemployment would drive millions of people into the streets.

Our economy would survive. Their government wouldn't.
 
Who's invading who?

One of the upsides of economic globalization is that superpower war isn't really possible without devastating both country's economies too much to make it worthwhile.

And it's not like either country could invade the other. What would the fight be over, exactly?

Some stupid BS like wars are usually fought over.

Agree that this is a ridiculous premise. US and China are like a couple who talk a big game individually, get into some public fights, but snuggle and call each other "schmupie" when they're alone.
 
The only thing that could likely bring modern superpowers to war would be scarce energy resources, but any government with sense is going to realize that such a war itself would likely destroy those resources in the process.

The days of territorial conquest and expansion -- the touchstone for almost every major conflict in world history -- are over, on a macro-scale, mainly because wealth and national economic prosperity no longer have any real tie to territory.
 
A friend of mine from Pakistan believes that the United States will soon by fighting a proxy war against China in Pakistan. I'm not so sure myself, I can't see us getting involved in a war against a country with nuclear weapons, but he is quite convinced.
 
Some stupid BS like wars are usually fought over.

Agree that this is a ridiculous premise. US and China are like a couple who talk a big game individually, get into some public fights, but snuggle and call each other "schmupie" when they're alone.

A Wake Forest and dook education and a position molding the leaders of tomorrow and that is how you spell "schmoopie?" You're better than that.
 
The only thing that could likely bring modern superpowers to war would be scarce energy resources, but any government with sense is going to realize that such a war itself would likely destroy those resources in the process.

The days of territorial conquest and expansion -- the touchstone for almost every major conflict in world history -- are over, on a macro-scale, mainly because wealth and national economic prosperity no longer have any real tie to territory.

This is abslutely true.

Additionally the Chinese understand a typical miltary action against the US would end in them losing.

Our Pacific and Indian Ocean fleets could pound the Chinese mainland with them have no such ability against our soil.

No one could invade the US due to our military technology. If you start a miltiary action against the US, it's your country that will bear the brunt of the destruction.
 
China barely has nuclear weapons, and has no aircraft carriers. We would crush them.

It's popular to laud China as some genius dominant superpower taking over for the US, but it's not reality. They peg their currency and oppress their people to corner the world in cheap labor - but there's no money in it anyway in the states. We're not going into China to find engineers to design the next iPhone. We go there to find some sucker to follow the directions we write for $2/hour because if we did it here nobody would take the job.

Congrats to China's government for leveraging the shit out of their billions of citizens. They're decades away from being able to beat us in anything other than basket weaving or a national tug-of-war contest.
 
We could never invade China. Putting aside nuclear weapons, China has a serious defensive missile capability that could blow holes in our pricey carrier fleets, should we bring them into Chinese waters. As everyone knows, the Chinese military is 80% defensive. If we tried to invade China, we'd lose.

China poses zero military threat to the US in terms of invasion, because it has no capacity to utilize its one major advantage- manpower. We could sink anything that floated from their harbors with no difficulty well before it approached US waters. The Chinese have no outlet through which to place hordes of troop on the ground in North America. Basically, whichever country tried to touch the other's shore would get mauled.

The number one military technology program in China -- and their greatest strategic threat to us -- is medium and long range ballistic missiles capable of sinking a carrier outside the range of the carrier's own missiles. The Chinese have missile bases within their interior mountains designed to hit targets on the coast while being outside the range of those targets. The purpose of such a program is to blunt US carrier fleets at sea, should we come to blows over Taiwan.

Which is why, unfortunately, if China ever really decides they want to take Taiwan they probably can do it, because there is no limited way we could stop it, and escalation over the island, realistically, doesn't make a lot of sense. I think everyone involved understands those facts, but China has no real interest in tipping the current status quo anyway. Contrary to beliefs in some circles, the Chinese do not want the US for an enemy. It serves no purpose for them.
 
Well, regardless of the impracticalities involved with either us invading the Chinese mainland or them invading the US, I'll bite. In such a scenario, it wouldn't simply be us vs. China, but another world war. It's a bit tough to apply current financial rules in such a case. It's not as simple as divesting itself of US treasury bills. When it comes to war, finances can and are seized...transactions are suspended...etc...

As for any actual war, the US has a disadvantage in numbers only. We still have the best military equipment and training on the planet, not to mention the better infrastructure in which to transport stuff domestically, something Eisenhower recognized as paramount when he started the interstate highways system.
 
We have the best military, no question, but it's not so much better than China's such that we could subdue their military completely, occupy their country, and remove a Chinese government without a popular revolt of the Chinese themselves. If we can't touch their shores, and they can't touch ours, and no one can use the major weapons, then all you have is a series of proxy wars or limited engagements accomplishing little. War with China just serves no purpose, for either nation. Again, what are we fighting for, if neither country is looking to expand their territory?

National stature is no longer tied to territorial ownership, making conventional ground war passe among superpowers. The way to rule the planet is to win economically. War with another superpower would likely cripple each nation's economy to the point that they both would lose out to the other superpowers.
 
As Arlington said, the concept of another old fashioned world war is archaic. the only place it could hapen is between India and China and neither would start one.
 
As Arlington said, the concept of another old fashioned world war is archaic. the only place it could hapen is between India and China and neither would start one.

Agreed, and again, what for? Neither China nor India is interested in taking a piece of the other country, nor could they hold it even if they were. So the only spark to a war between the two would be something purely retributive like, say, revenge for an economic situation or to directly hurt the other's economy. But the rest of global community wouldn't stand for such a tactic, and the economic punishment doled out would almost certainly be worse than whatever the dispute was in the first place.

The only rational way a conflict could start between superpowers would be if one nation was meddling with the internal politics of another, or perhaps supporting terrorist attacks upon the other (both highly unlikely among the superpowers). That or, as I said, a growing scarcity of energy resources forcing a hand. But the superpowers are the AIGs of the global economy, so hurting one hurts all, and serves very little purpose. Hoarding energy resources to the detriment of another superpower would end of boomeranging back on the hoarder. There's no point.
 
Well, regardless of the impracticalities involved with either us invading the Chinese mainland or them invading the US, I'll bite. In such a scenario, it wouldn't simply be us vs. China, but another world war. It's a bit tough to apply current financial rules in such a case. It's not as simple as divesting itself of US treasury bills. When it comes to war, finances can and are seized...transactions are suspended...etc...

As for any actual war, the US has a disadvantage in numbers only. We still have the best military equipment and training on the planet, not to mention the better infrastructure in which to transport stuff domestically, something Eisenhower recognized as paramount when he started the interstate highways system.

Aforementioned India along with Russia would all but have to get involved, would they not?
 
We could never invade China. Putting aside nuclear weapons, China has a serious defensive missile capability that could blow holes in our pricey carrier fleets, should we bring them into Chinese waters. As everyone knows, the Chinese military is 80% defensive. If we tried to invade China, we'd lose.

China poses zero military threat to the US in terms of invasion, because it has no capacity to utilize its one major advantage- manpower. We could sink anything that floated from their harbors with no difficulty well before it approached US waters. The Chinese have no outlet through which to place hordes of troop on the ground in North America. Basically, whichever country tried to touch the other's shore would get mauled.

The number one military technology program in China -- and their greatest strategic threat to us -- is medium and long range ballistic missiles capable of sinking a carrier outside the range of the carrier's own missiles. The Chinese have missile bases within their interior mountains designed to hit targets on the coast while being outside the range of those targets. The purpose of such a program is to blunt US carrier fleets at sea, should we come to blows over Taiwan.

Which is why, unfortunately, if China ever really decides they want to take Taiwan they probably can do it, because there is no limited way we could stop it, and escalation over the island, realistically, doesn't make a lot of sense. I think everyone involved understands those facts, but China has no real interest in tipping the current status quo anyway. Contrary to beliefs in some circles, the Chinese do not want the US for an enemy. It serves no purpose for them.

China's ASBM program has been overestimated by many in the West, specifically by those who stand to gain from creating a panic over Chinese military power. They still cannot project force outside of the South China Sea and the Sea of Japan, and even those bodies of water are contested by U.S. military might. Could we win a land war? Probably not. Do we need a land war in order to beat China? No. Realistically, they could be beaten into submission without a single brigade setting foot onto the mainland. This wouldn't result in a decisive victory with an unconditional surrender, but then again, those rarely occur throughout history. Winning a war doesn't entail completely destroying an enemy. As it stands right now, the single most contentious geopolitical issue involving the United States and China is the existence of Taiwan. If China ever tried to invade Taiwan, and yes, that is a distinct possibility, that would result in war. China would have to totally conquer the entire island within a matter of days if they wanted to have any chance of defeating the U.S. in such a conflict.

All it would take is a week or so for additional carrier groups to arrive at Taiwan, and if the Chinese haven't achieved total victory at that point, then they will have lost the island.
 
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