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Chicago teachers are striking

DiegoTiger said:
The teachers I know basically fight each other to teach summer school, which has limited positions. I guarantee most teachers would love more time in the class.
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They fight to teach summer school for free or they fight to teach more time and get paid for it?
 
Junebug said:
I'm not attempting to denigrate it. It takes skills that I don't have, and I would be terrible at it. Being the "brightest," however, is not required.

Moreover, it doesnt require the same amount of work as typical private sector jobs, and, thus, to encourage smart people to do the job, we don't need to pay them a salary commensurate with private sector wages. I would have thought this was relatively uncontroversial.
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Without good teachers there aren't people to do those other jobs.
 
Junebug said:
No. Apples and oranges.
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When I go to the grocery store, apples and oranges have values. I think oranges have less value, maybe because I'm in FL. Are the lawyers the apples or the oranges?
 
WakeandBake said:
How have you reached these conclusions?

In a vacuum, if you had a kid, would you want him to be taught science by a brilliant scientist or by a pretty good science teacher?
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The best teacher. Which, incidentally, isn't always the smartest of the two. In fact, given my experience at Wake, I would argue there is a negative correlation between the two. Let the genius work on figuring out a cure for cancer, alternative energy sources, new type of weapon, whatever. Let the guy who gets it reasonably well teach it to high schoolers.
 
PhDeac said:
When I go to the grocery store, apples and oranges have values. I think oranges have less value, maybe because I'm in FL. Are the lawyers the apples or the oranges?
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the buckeye
 
Junebug said:
The best teacher. Which, incidentally, isn't always the smartest of the two. In fact, given my experience at Wake, I would argue there is a negative correlation between the two. Let the genius work on figuring out a cure for cancer, alternative energy sources, new type of weapon, whatever. Let the guy who gets it reasonably well teach it to high schoolers.
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We need reasonable well teachers so we'll have reasonable well students, amirite?
 
WakeandBake said:
The DAs and public defenders need to make more, then. I'm all for it (provided that marijuana laws are stricken from the books and not clogging the caseload).

To hear someone whine about their public fisc contribution being too big, and constantly needing cuts to create jobs, chastise teachers for deserving higher salary sounds like typical trickle-down hoodwinking to me.
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We just need to plant some more money trees.
 
Teachers contribution to society and the world >>>>> Junebug as a lawyer/most lawyers therefore Teachers salary>>>>> Junebug/lawyers. That would be how things in the real world should work, yet dont
 
Hey Lou, I lost Laurie's phone number. Drop me a PM.

I could use a new D'Back jacket....oh that's right you copped so much free stuff, they make everyone pay cost now.
 
Junebug said:
We just need to plant some more money trees.
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Nah, we need to really kill government through underfunding. It is the method du jour of the small gubmint right. So long as those taxes never, ever go up and destroy the fragile businessman's carrot we might just survive as a nation. I know, its very delicate, that incentive for a man in businesses to go out and succeed. Not so much for teachers, you know, cause 76k seems like - how did you phrase it? 'plenty.'
 
WakeandBake said:
The measurement for 'results' is a crock of shit, according to the teachers. Your reaction to that is to suspect them of gaming the system. You want accountability? Give them what they need. Ever run a company or a department within one that was underfunded and under-resourced? I have, and it is damn near impossible to meet expectations which are set for fully a fully funded department.

Your approach is to demand results without providing the necessary tools. You just posted 'the schools suck.' So your solution then is to beat back the teachers, fold your arms and tap your foot, and wait for the awesome magical results to come in.
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Let's see. There are 27,000 teachers in the Chicago Public Schools. They have an average salary of 76K. They have rejected a 16% raise over 4 years. That raise - which they have rejected as inadequate - amounts to almost $330 million dollars to the existing teachers. The same teachers. Not new ones. The ones who have been teaching in the really shitty schools. I presume we could come up with something more useful to do with that $330 million bucks for the schools than hand it over to the existing teachers. Never mind the other benefits they are demanding.
 
Once again DeacMan doesn't know what he's talking about. What's keeping the contract from being signed isn't compensation. It's the teacher evaluation rules that is stopping the contract.
 
DeacMan said:
Let's see. There are 27,000 teachers in the Chicago Public Schools. They have an average salary of 76K. They have rejected a 16% raise over 4 years. That raise - which they have rejected as inadequate - amounts to almost $330 million dollars to the existing teachers. The same teachers. Not new ones. The ones who have been teaching in the really shitty schools. I presume we could come up with something more useful to do with that $330 million bucks for the schools than hand it over to the existing teachers. Never mind the other benefits they are demanding.
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I have several friends who are college profs who don't sniff that amount.
 
Junebug said:
I'm not attempting to denigrate it. It takes skills that I don't have, and I would be terrible at it. Being the "brightest," however, is not required.

Moreover, it doesnt require the same amount of work as typical private sector jobs, and, thus, to encourage smart people to do the job, we don't need to pay them a salary commensurate with private sector wages. I would have thought this was relatively uncontroversial.
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I think you don't have a complete understanding of how much work is truly involved. As for being the "brightest," I don't think that's required for any profession. Not sure who set up that straw-man for you.
 
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WakeandBake said:
The measurement for 'results' is a crock of shit, according to the teachers. Your reaction to that is to suspect them of gaming the system. You want accountability? Give them what they need. Ever run a company or a department within one that was underfunded and under-resourced? I have, and it is damn near impossible to meet expectations which are set for fully a fully funded department.

Your approach is to demand results without providing the necessary tools. You just posted 'the schools suck.' So your solution then is to beat back the teachers, fold your arms and tap your foot, and wait for the awesome magical results to come in.
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Holy shit, your name is "WakeAndBake" and you have "run a company" before? I honestly thought you were a Wake Forest freshman or sophomore, or something in that range.
 
Ball State Deac said:
I think you don't have a complete understanding of how much work is truly involved. As for being the "brightest," I don't think that's required for any provision. Not sure who set up that straw-man for you.
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Oh, I get it. I've taught a law class as an adjunct. It's not easy. But once it's done once, it requires very little upkeep.
 
Junebug said:
Oh, I get it. I've taught a law class as an adjunct. It's not easy. But once it's done once, it requires very little upkeep.
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This is a joke, right? You're comparing being an adjunct law professor with being an elementary school teacher?
 
they are just 5 and 6 year olds ph. no biggie
 
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