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Army to Congress: Thanks but no tanks

ONW

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http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/10/09/army-to-congress-thanks-but-no-tanks/?hpt=hp_c1


"HERLONG, California (CNN) - If you need an example of why it is hard to cut the budget in Washington look no further than this Army depot in the shadow of the Sierra Nevada range.

CNN was allowed rare access to what amounts to a parking lot for more than 2,000 M-1 Abrams tanks. Here, about an hour's drive north of Reno, Nevada, the tanks have been collecting dust in the hot California desert because of a tiff between the Army and Congress.

The U.S. has more than enough combat tanks in the field to meet the nation's defense needs - so there's no sense in making repairs to these now, the Army's chief of staff Gen. Raymond T. Odierno told Congress earlier this year.


If the Pentagon holds off repairing, refurbishing or making new tanks for three years until new technologies are developed, the Army says it can save taxpayers as much as $3 billion.

Why is this a big deal? For one, the U.S. hasn't stopped producing tanks since before World War II, according to lawmakers.

Plus, from its point of view the Army would prefer to decide what it needs and doesn't need to keep America strong while making tough economic cuts elsewhere."

"Rep. Buck McKeon, chairman of the House armed services committee, said he didn't know General Dynamics had given him $56,000 in campaign contributions since 2009 until CNN asked him about it.

"You know, the Army has a job to do and we have a job to do," McKeon said. "And they have tough choices because they've been having their budget cut."

McKeon said he's thinking about the long range view. "... If someone could guarantee us that we'll never need tanks in the future, that would be good. I don't see that guarantee."


Washington, D.C.....All of you suck at everything, and you're rapidly catching up with Jersey, Texas, Florida, and Ohio in my top property to sell to the UAE draft.
 
I've heard similar stories like this from some friends in the military of billions of dollars in surplus equipment (in some cases brand new) sitting around collecting dust. I had one friend in the Coast Guard who told me the story of how they bought two new helicopters they had no need for because if they didn't spend the money, they wouldn't get it again the next year. This kind of budgeting is what is killing us all across the public sector.
 
I had a good discussion about that with some folks a few weeks ago. My solution was to institute a raffle with surplus funds with which the winning agency or project could put toward a big project they otherwise could never get approval for. Doesn't work as well for DOD compared to other agencies but it would be a way to incentivize efficiency.
 
I had a good discussion about that with some folks a few weeks ago. My solution was to institute a raffle with surplus funds with which the winning agency or project could put toward a big project they otherwise could never get approval for. Doesn't work as well for DOD compared to other agencies but it would be a way to incentivize efficiency.

I have a better idea. We should use the surplus funds for something extraordinary, like paying down debt.
 
I have a better idea. We should use the surplus funds for something extraordinary, like paying down debt.

Most of the total surplus across agencies would and a percentage would be the pot. Sadly, debt reduction isn't enough incentive.
 
I've heard similar stories like this from some friends in the military of billions of dollars in surplus equipment (in some cases brand new) sitting around collecting dust. I had one friend in the Coast Guard who told me the story of how they bought two new helicopters they had no need for because if they didn't spend the money, they wouldn't get it again the next year. This kind of budgeting is what is killing us all across the public sector.

that's funny because some of the cutters are falling apart according to my sister. some of those ships are old as hell and need to be replaced.
 
I had a good discussion about that with some folks a few weeks ago. My solution was to institute a raffle with surplus funds with which the winning agency or project could put toward a big project they otherwise could never get approval for. Doesn't work as well for DOD compared to other agencies but it would be a way to incentivize efficiency.

A lottery where we randomly award agencies funding for big projects that are unnecessary? Is this a joke?
 
A lottery where we randomly award agencies funding for big projects that are unnecessary? Is this a joke?

Who says they are unnecessary? You have to be creative to incentivize efficiency in the public sector.
 
that's funny because some of the cutters are falling apart according to my sister. some of those ships are old as hell and need to be replaced.

My guess is they have enough for two new helicopters, but not a new Cutter. They spend it to keep the budget higher next year, but never have enough for a new cutter because they can't save it and spend more in year two.
 
Except this has been against federal law for over 35 years.

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My guess is they have enough for two new helicopters, but not a new Cutter. They spend it to keep the budget higher next year, but never have enough for a new cutter because they can't save it and spend more in year two.

yeah it's just sad that money like this goes wasted rather than stockpiling for an area of need. my sister's at the academy and 2 years ago we went to some of her classes on family weekend. one of her engineering classes on materials (she's a naval architecture major -- designing ships) they showed pics of how rusted out some of the cutters are beneath the deck. was pretty scary looking because some were barely seaworthy and needed tons of repairs.
 
seems to me that if you got the private money out of elections we could have a Congress that wasn't beholding to the donors and could have some real oversight and a Government that could make some hard choices for the good of the country instead of their donor base.
 
why isnt the capital budgeting of huge pieces of the government with gigantic cap ex needs done on a 5 or 10 year basis? that would easily fix this use it or lose it problem. maybe we do need someone who knows how to run a company running the government?
 
why isnt the capital budgeting of huge pieces of the government with gigantic cap ex needs done on a 5 or 10 year basis? that would easily fix this use it or lose it problem. maybe we do need someone who knows how to run a company running the government?

how do you know it isn't?
 
why isnt the capital budgeting of huge pieces of the government with gigantic cap ex needs done on a 5 or 10 year basis? that would easily fix this use it or lose it problem. maybe we do need someone who knows how to run a company running the government?

McNamara and pals tried it in the 1960s with PPBS and different versions of budgeting plans have been implemented ever since. It doesn't quite work out right. If we had more of a top-down budgeting process it probably would, but we've put funding the government in the hands of Congress.
 
why isnt the capital budgeting of huge pieces of the government with gigantic cap ex needs done on a 5 or 10 year basis? that would easily fix this use it or lose it problem. maybe we do need someone who knows how to run a company running the government?

The guy who "knows how to run a company" wants to spend $1T more than the DOD wants or needs. That shows real business sense.

He also wants to cut $2.8T in taxes from the Top 5% and says he will "balance" that out by eliminating loopholes. The problem is if he ended ALL loopholes it would only total $1.7T.

We're down $2T from where we are today before we even get started.

That's a really good way to run the "business" of the government.
 
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