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Gun Control Laws

http://www.koaa.com/news/local-gun-sales-spike-in-wake-of-connecticut-school-shooting/
Local gun sales spike in wake of Connecticut school shooting
In the aftermath of the mass shooting at an elementary school in Connecticut that left 27 people dead, including 20 children, gun sales have spiked in El Paso County as many believe stricter gun control laws may be passed in reaction to the tragedy.

Dragonman's guns saw a rush of customers as news of the mass shooting spread on Friday. Among those looking to buy an assault rifle was Joseph Lakatos, who said he decided to make a purchase after seeing public statements by President Obama and Colorado Governor John Hickenlooper in which both men hinted that a serious discussion about gun laws lay ahead for the state and the country.

"I've seen in the news that they're talking about having an assault weapons ban and I wanted to make sure I got my opportunity to buy an AK-47 before they did the assault ban," Lakatos explained, saying he was also affected by the shooting. "I was hurt personally, anytime someone uses a weapon against a person that's always a bad thing, it even makes it worse when you talk about little children."

An assault weapons ban has been discussed in the wake of the Aurora theater shooting and other mass shooting events. Mel Bernstein, owner of Dragonman's Guns, believes a ban is inevitable now.

"I have a feeling that this was the last straw," Bernstein said.

It seemed that many of Bernstein's customers on Friday believed the same thing.

"Just this morning nine guns were sold with this fella right here," Bernstein described pointing to Joseph Lakatos. "Because he figures after this he'll probably never be able to get one for at least ten years."
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Mike Huckabee blames getting God out of classroom for shootings
Americans should blame their schools, and removal of God from the classroom, for Friday’s murders of schoolchildren in Connecticut, according to former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, a 2008 Republican presidential candidate who is now a pundit and host on Fox News.

Huckabee did not mention guns, gun culture, or assault rifles in talking about the country’s latest mass killing, but said on Fox News:

“We ask why there is violence in our schools, but we have systematically removed God from our schools. Should we be surprised that schools would become places of carnage?”
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http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattlepolitics/2012/12/14/absence-of-god-from-schools-to-blame-for-killings-huckabee/
 
Guns are far too easily attainable, I agree. But our indifference to the mentallly crippled, is the real tragedy. And I hate to say it, but our healthcare system blows. Nobody is accountable, and nobody has faith in our ability to deal with our mentally troubled. Its only gonna get worse.
 
Hello said:
Guns are too easy to get and there are too many sick people in America now. We're devolving.
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Correct and correct.

Meanwhile, the State of North Carolina just got a sweet land deal closing Dix Hospital. Fighting this awful, disgusting phenomenon will be a multifront effort.

Clearly we need better gun control laws, but I'm not for an outright ban. Limited types of guns have a limited place. If I'm a working class homeowner in Chicago, or a rancher along the former border between the United States and Mexico, I have a responsibility to my family that the government is blatantly refusing to do.

I own two guns, and they each have a different purpose. Neither of my lawfully owned firearms has a purpose that requires enough ammunition to shoot more than eight rounds (and of course that would be an extreme situation). If somebody breaks in my house and poses a thread to my family, 9-1-1 isn't going to get there in time. As a responsible person with lawfully owned guns stored securely in my home where only I can get them, I'm not a threat to anybody else that hasn't broken into my house.

We need far strictly penalties for gun crimes. The responsible possession of a registered, personal protection firearm is not a crime. Irresponsibly losing possession and accountability of a personal protection firearm should carry strict civil and criminal liability. As someone pointed out, there are more restrictions on buying Claritin-D than shotguns. THAT is insane.

I also think the people who talk about our culture of celebrated violence are on to something. It's absolutely everywhere. I appreciate the fact that many people in Hollywood have strong feelings about gun control (many of which are valid), but filming a somber PSA in between takes on the Jason Bourne series strikes me as hypocritical. Part of our gun culture is its constant validation in theater and on t.v.

This is a multi-faceted problem in need of a multi-faceted response.
 
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I couldn't find a link, but NPR had a guy on yesterday afternoon who claimed that - recent events notwithstanding - the number of people in the U.S. killed by mass murders/mass shootings is around 100, and that number has been pretty much the same for decades. We obviously have a problem in this country, but it made me feel a little better to hear that the problem is not necessarily getting worse.

ETA: Yesterday's events are particularly devastating given the age of the children. I cannot imaging doing something as routine as dropping off my 5-year old at their elementary school and then never seeing them again.
 
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DeacinBama said:
I couldn't find a link, but NPR had a guy on yesterday afternoon who claimed that - recent events notwithstanding - the number of people in the U.S. killed by mass murders/mass shootings is around 100, and that number has been pretty much the same for decades. We obviously have a problem in this country, but it made me feel a little better to hear that the problem is not necessarily getting worse.

ETA: Yesterday's events are particularly devastating given the age of the children. I cannot imaging doing something as routine as dropping off my 5-year old at their elementary school and then never seeing them again.
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I found myself actively avoiding the news for the first time in my life.
 
So in Chicago last night, 10 people were shot, including 4 teens. Just another night in America.
 
BillBrasky said:
Guns are far too easily attainable, I agree. But our indifference to the mentallly crippled, is the real tragedy. And I hate to say it, but our healthcare system blows. Nobody is accountable, and nobody has faith in our ability to deal with our mentally troubled. Its only gonna get worse.
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This has got to be part of the discussion. If the gun lobby is too strong, maybe we can get some funding for mental health.
 
How about let's also discuss the effects of kids playing video games in which they shoot everything that moves as a "game". There is no way anyone can convince me that these types of stimuli along with the explosion of violence in our "entertainment" arenas have no effect on young developing minds and personalities. These type "games" have been used by the military to help soilders shoot people. I know it is an old argument but I have never heard of a gun just jumping up in the air and shooting people. Gun ownership is probably lower as a percentage of homes than it has ever been. In 1776, everyone had one. We have to find out the reason that people are wanting to commit these acts. Just look at internet message boards. People type stuff all of the time they never say to an actual person's face. How about all of these "mental health" drugs that we feed kids from the time they are 5. Also no way of knowing what long term effects on the developing mind of a young person. The reason people bring abortion to the table is the same as physician assisted suicide, right to die and everything else. Each of these bring a certain lowering of the "value" of a human life. Doesn't matter if it is an embryo, fetus, baby, kindergartener, or 95 year old woman. When we "cheapen" life it always, little by little, desensitizes people to ending it.
 
Let's have a conversation about everything. We need to invest in mental health counseling. Let's talk about our cultural perspective on violence.

But your argument about everyone owning a muzzle loading musket in 1776 versus half of American households owning multiple weapons (many semi-automatic with high capacity magazines) doesn't hold water
 
The people who fight and lobby and legislate to make guns regularly available are complicit in the murder of those children. They have made a clear moral choice: that the comfort and emotional reassurance they take from the possession of guns, placed in the balance even against the routine murder of innocent children, is of supreme value. Whatever satisfaction gun owners take from their guns—we know for certain that there is no prudential value in them—is more important than children’s lives. Give them credit: life is making moral choices, and that’s a moral choice, clearly made.


Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blo...wn-and-the-madness-of-guns.html#ixzz2F8Hq1qyA
 
89DeaconMike said:
How about let's also discuss the effects of kids playing video games in which they shoot everything that moves as a "game". There is no way anyone can convince me that these types of stimuli along with the explosion of violence in our "entertainment" arenas have no effect on young developing minds and personalities. These type "games" have been used by the military to help soilders shoot people. I know it is an old argument but I have never heard of a gun just jumping up in the air and shooting people. Gun ownership is probably lower as a percentage of homes than it has ever been. In 1776, everyone had one. We have to find out the reason that people are wanting to commit these acts. Just look at internet message boards. People type stuff all of the time they never say to an actual person's face. How about all of these "mental health" drugs that we feed kids from the time they are 5. Also no way of knowing what long term effects on the developing mind of a young person. The reason people bring abortion to the table is the same as physician assisted suicide, right to die and everything else. Each of these bring a certain lowering of the "value" of a human life. Doesn't matter if it is an embryo, fetus, baby, kindergartener, or 95 year old woman. When we "cheapen" life it always, little by little, desensitizes people to ending it.
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Research has consistently shown that the most important factor (with EVERYTHING else being held equal) in gun death, is the presence of guns. It's silly to ignore that the widespread availability of guns and jump on other reasons just because your gut tells you that they must have something to do with it.
 
Do all you gun control types honestly think that any of your proposed regulations (short of an outright ban on all guns) would have prevented this? Don't shotguns and rifles kill people too? Yeah, I get number of bullets/ease of carrying/concealment etc., but a determined psychopath is going plan ahead. Maybe the death toll is 26 instead of 28, but the tragedy wouldn't have been prevented.
 
Junebug said:
Do all you gun control types honestly think that any of your proposed regulations (short of an outright ban on all guns) would have prevented this? Don't shotguns and rifles kill people too? Yeah, I get number of bullets/ease of carrying/concealment etc., but a determined psychopath is going plan ahead. Maybe the death toll is 26 instead of 28, but the tragedy wouldn't have been prevented.
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Saving the lives of 2 kids is worth it.

Should we have made no changes to National Security in response to September 11?
 
Junebug said:
Do all you gun control types honestly think that any of your proposed regulations (short of an outright ban on all guns) would have prevented this? Don't shotguns and rifles kill people too? Yeah, I get number of bullets/ease of carrying/concealment etc., but a determined psychopath is going plan ahead. Maybe the death toll is 26 instead of 28, but the tragedy wouldn't have been prevented.
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I don't know if it would have prevented this specific incident, but I think it would drastically reduce the gun deaths that don't make the national media that happen every day (accidental shootings, teenagers killing each other, domestic arguments, etc.)

Honestly, I don't know how anyone could argue against making it HARDER for crazy people to buy guns. It SHOULD be hard. We make people jump through a lot of hoops just to drive a car (licensing, inspections, mandatory insurance). People should jump through at least as many to own a gun.
 
There are about 30,000 gun-related fatalities in the US each year. If gun laws bring that number down to 25,000, is that not a good thing?
 
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