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Thread: F is for Fascism (Ferguson MO)

  1. #381
    It's crazy how much leeway and trust a gun license carries with some of you. As if the badge was justification in itself.
    Draxx them sklounst

  2. #382
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    Quote Originally Posted by myDeaconmyhand View Post
    It's crazy how much leeway and trust a gun license carries with some of you. As if the badge was justification in itself.
    It is amazing. That and the complete lack of respect for human life. Life is just acceptable losses for the price of the second amendment.

  3. #383
    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    Whoever she is (she identified herself only as "Josie"), she's smart to call in anonymously. Considering what was done to the liquor store, she'd be dead by tomorrow.
    As long as she's not jaywalking, she's considerably ahead of the game.

  4. #384

  5. #385
    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    This isn't a second amendment issue. Are you contending officers shouldn't have guns?
    I would like for there to be legal consequences for killing someone in self defense, even for police officers.
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  6. #386
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    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    Whoever she is (she identified herself only as "Josie"), she's smart to call in anonymously. Considering what was done to the liquor store, she'd be dead by tomorrow.
    If this proceeds to trial she would almost certainly be called to testify as a defense witness, correct?

  7. #387
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milhouse View Post
    oh we all know the answer
    Lol

  8. #388
    I think a lot of security and protection measures would change if there was an automatic 6 month jail sentence for any killing in self defense, or for deaths resulting from a stolen or privately sold firearm.
    Last edited by myDeaconmyhand; 08-18-2014 at 06:27 PM.
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  9. #389
    Quote Originally Posted by myDeaconmyhand View Post
    I think a lot of security and protection measures would change if there was an automatic 6 month jail sentence for any killing in self defense, or for deaths resulting from a stolen or sold firearm.
    Quote Originally Posted by myDeaconmyhand View Post
    I would like for there to be legal consequences for killing someone in self defense, even for police officers.
    So if some maniac breaks into your house and tries to rape your women and murder everyone, and you kill him, you should go to prison?

  10. #390
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL68 View Post
    So if some maniac breaks into your house and tries to rape your women and murder everyone, and you kill him, you should go to prison?
    I'd consider exceptions for protecting someone else, and home invasion cases. Killing an unarmed person in the street shouldn't be categorized the same as killing an armed person in your own house. I've never heard of an entire community protesting the death of a home invader.
    Draxx them sklounst

  11. #391
    Quote Originally Posted by myDeaconmyhand View Post
    I would like for there to be legal consequences for killing someone in self defense, even for police officers.
    You do?

    John Michael Hayes walked up to passing motorists, flagged down their cars and shot them at point blank rage with a shot gun. He was found not guilty by reason of insanity. There wasn't a question who the shooter was or who the aggressor was, but based on the insanity defense he is a free man today (he was released from his rehab facility a few years back).

    Ditto for Wendell Williamson, the UNC campus shooter who had prepositioned ammunition around campus so when he went on his killing spree, he could reload. An Orange County jury acquitted him on the same grounds.

    Those cases are deplorable legal outcomes. The defense of insanity in homicide cases---when the person had the foresight to preposition ammo days in advance---is the only insane thing that happened in that case. THAT defense needs a complete overhaul.

    I lack the omnipotence of many of the eyewitnesses to the Ferguson, MO killing that have been posting here with such frequency. I don't know what happened. Did the person who just robbed a convenience store 960 seconds before he was confronted by an LEO forget that he had just robbed a convenience store, or was his adrenaline still up at the time? I have no idea. Can't know. Will never know. Did he deserve to die? It certainly doesn't appear like it, but I wasn't there so I have no way of knowing what went on.

    But if, as you say, there should be legal consequences for killing in self defense, what would you have the officer do? I assume there had to be some altercation, unless you want to produce evidence (or in the case of certain posters, manufacture out of thin air) evidence that the cop snuck up behind him and shot him in cold blood. If you're in a physical fight with someone who is better than you and you have a gun on your person, are you under a duty to pretend it isn't there? Wait for the bigger person to reach for it first? Only engage suspects who don't fight back?

    Nobody wants this kid dead, so save the sanctimony. Your notion that people who act in self defense should still face consequences is either an emotional oversimplification or a fundamental misunderstanding of several million years of human behavior. I would agree with you if you were to say "aggressors" who eventually kill in self defense should face consequences, but shouldn't we wait to see who the aggressor is before passing judgment? Si or no?
    Last edited by jhmd2000; 08-18-2014 at 06:38 PM.

  12. #392
    Quote Originally Posted by KickballDeac View Post
    If this proceeds to trial she would almost certainly be called to testify as a defense witness, correct?
    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    If they can figure out who it is, yes. I'd imagine she's seek witness protection long before that, though.
    Pretty sure she was giving the cop's account of what happened, she's not a witness.

  13. #393
    Quote Originally Posted by jhmd2000 View Post
    You do?

    John Michael Hayes walked up to passing motorists, flagged down their cars and shot them at point blank rage with a shot gun. He was found not guilty by reason of insanity. There wasn't a question who the shooter was or who the aggressor was, but based on the insanity defense he is a free man today (he was released from his rehab facility a few years back).

    Ditto for Wendell Williamson, the UNC campus shooter who had prepositioned ammunition around campus so when he went on his killing spree, he could reload. An Orange County jury acquitted him on the same grounds.

    Those cases are deplorable legal outcomes.

    I lack the omnipotence of many of the eyewitnesses to the Ferguson, MO killing that have been posting here with such frequency. I don't know what happened. Did the person who just robbed a convenience store 960 seconds before he was confronted by an LEO forget that he had just robbed a convenience store, or was his adrenaline still up at the time? I have no idea. Can't know. Will never know. Did he deserve to die? It certainly doesn't appear like it, but I wasn't there so I have no way of knowing what went on.

    But if, as you say, there should be legal consequences for killing in self defense, what would you have the officer do? I assume there had to be some altercation, unless you want to produce evidence (or in the case of certain posters, manufacture out of thin air) evidence that the cop snuck up behind him and shot him in cold blood. If you're in a physical fight with someone who is better than you and you have a gun on your person, are you under a duty to pretend it isn't there? Wait for the bigger person to reach for it first? Only engage suspects who don't fight back?

    Nobody wants this kid dead, so save the sanctimony. Your notion that people who act in self defense should still face consequences is either an emotional oversimplification or a fundamental misunderstanding of several million years of human behavior. I would agree with you if you were to say "aggressors" who eventually kill in self defense should face consequences, but shouldn't we wait to see who the aggressor is before passing judgment? Si or no?
    Always assuming that shooting someone to death is the only defense option is the ultimate oversimplification IMO. I refuse to believe that the Furguson officer, and thousands of others throughout history, have had no other options besides shooting someone multiple times until they died, or even firing multiple times to begin with. If your life is truly on the line and you have no other options, then a few months jail time wouldn't stop you from protecting yourself. Dead people can't defend themselves, but our justice system refuses to acknowledge that.
    Last edited by myDeaconmyhand; 08-18-2014 at 06:45 PM.
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  14. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    Whoever she is (she identified herself only as "Josie"), she's smart to call in anonymously. Considering what was done to the liquor store, she'd be dead by tomorrow.
    Like mike Brown...maybe if she didn't say it, a cop would come looking for her.

    The difference between your premise and mine is that a cop did kill an unarmed citizen, but no citizen has killed a cop or an alleged witness.

    Your post is evil and horrific. It speaks deeply and thoroughly about what you really think.

  15. #395
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    How did the insane dude get his ammo?

  16. #396
    If you are struggling for a cop's gun or attacking him and you get shot, then the cop is doing his job. Some of you are completely whack. Now the facts are in dispute about what happened here, but there are plenty of circumstances where a police officer shooting an unarmed person being completely justified.

    All PD should wear those portable video devices. It would eliminate alot of the uncertainty in these cases.
    Last edited by ChrisL68; 08-18-2014 at 07:11 PM.

  17. #397
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL68 View Post
    If you are struggling for a cop's gun or attacking him and you get shot, then the cop is doing his job. Some of you are completely whack.
    I don't know if you are talking to me, but this is about third or fourth time I've said this. Had Brown gotten shot while tussling with the cop while the cop was in his car, it was on Brown.

    Once the cop left and then backed up for a second confrontation, got out of his car and started shooting a person he knew was unarmed, then it's on the cop.

    My guess is if 923 or BSD is looking at this thread or avalon (she's a lawyer I think), if you are in fight, the fight breaks up; you start driving away; you back up; get out of your car; pull a gun and empty into the person you were fighting, you can be charged with premeditated murder. You wsould have had plenty of time to create premeditation.

    Back to Junebug's post, I cannot fathom how evil that it was. He's stating he believes a person or group of people from Ferguson would seek out and murder the alleged "witness" if her identity was known.

    He said "she'd be dead by tomorrow."

    Those were his words. No one has attacked Wilson. No one has protested by his home. No one has attacked or sought out the Chief of Police to him harm.

    Junebug has gone way over any line of decency.

  18. #398
    If that is what happened I agree, but its not clear at all that's what happened.

  19. #399

  20. #400
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    She's a regular PJ Hairston.

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