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Good read on CEO pay and stakeholder governance

TuffaloDeac10 said:
fredgraph.png
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Exactly. Happy Halloween.
 
i notice that no one has made a chart of total government expenditures for the past thirty+ years. Fred does track "total government expenditures" doesn't it?
 
tjcmd said:
i notice that no one has made a chart of total government expenditures for the past thirty+ years. Fred does track "total government expenditures" doesn't it?
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Same story. This is boring.

fredgraph.png


The difference between this series and the consumption and gross investment series is that this includes transfer payments and interest on the debt. Neither, to me, are examples of government intrusiveness. Many people don't even think Medicare and SS are government programs so I don't think they can be described as intrusive government.
 
Total government expenditures are actually going up over time. If you include state and local, it is now about 33% of the economy (even of the inflated economy after printing up trillions of paper dollars). Way too much for any libertarian and way too much to be consistent with a free market system. And that does not even include the government mandates and regulations foisted on the economy in recent times. I think government is definitely more intrusive now than it was years ago.
 
I don't know if that number is accurate or not, but even if it is why is that bad? Wouldn't these expenditures be happening be largely from private American firms? Who are the biggest vendors to fed state and local governments?
 
If you believe in central planning, it is not bad. I don't believe central planning works in most areas.
 
Ok but you expressed that you feel if government expenditures were at some lower point that the market would correct its stagnant wage problem and its income disparity problem. How does that work?
 
I still don't understand why anyone would care what a private entity pays their employees. The private company needs to make a profit to stay in business (unlike the govt) and can structure their pay anyway they like (as long as it is above the minimum wage). If they over pay people (including the CEO, CIO, and various Michael Scotts), then they will suffer on the bottom line.

Truth Bomb!
 
I agree that there is overregulation, mainly at the state and local level with ridiculous licensing regimes that primarily protect incumbents and not consumers, and in the ridiculously complex federal tax code. Thats a different topic from whether the government is "too big" as a percentage of the economy (as if there is some magical number). I am for better and more efficient government, but do not buy into the fetish for smaller government for the sake of smaller government. The facts show that government is smaller now than 20 years ago, and the loss of millions of government jobs is a significant contributor to the hollowing out of the middle class in this country.
 
bobknightfan said:
And that is exactly why I have more faith & confidence in the government to do what is right for its citizens than I have in corporations to do what is right for its employees.

Thanks for pointing that out, Hulka....that the corporations don't give a fuck about their employees. That making as big a profit as possible is what is important to them.
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Bob, I think you missed my point. Corporations have to compete and govt does not. Therefore, if they are paying their employees more than they are worth then they will eventually go out of business. Also, if companies treated their employees so poorly, they would go to the competition(at least the good ones would).

Govt does not have to compete.

BTW, I am sorry, but I am done here. I just wanted to drop some truth bombs. If you would like to continue this, send me a PM and we can discuss.
 
Sgt Hulka said:
Bob, I think you missed my point. Corporations have to compete and govt does not. Therefore, if they are paying their employees more than they are worth then they will eventually go out of business. Also, if companies treated their employees so poorly, they would go to the competition(at least the good ones would).

Govt does not have to compete.

BTW, I am sorry, but I am done here. I just wanted to drop some truth bombs. If you would like to continue this, send me a PM and we can discuss.
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Family-Dinner-without-TV-1950s-Medium-Web-view.jpg
 
Sgt Hulka said:
I still don't understand why anyone would care what a private entity pays their employees. The private company needs to make a profit to stay in business (unlike the govt) and can structure their pay anyway they like (as long as it is above the minimum wage). If they over pay people (including the CEO, CIO, and various Michael Scotts), then they will suffer on the bottom line.

Truth Bomb!
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Your post is a vast oversimplification and barely a half truth. Neither large nor small companies start at the top when trimming fat. I've yet in my life to see a scenario where a company failed to reach it's goals and responded by lowering the salaries of it's highest paid employees. There are always layoffs to be made, divisions to be jettisoned, and benefits to be cut.
 
One group posts charts to support their points. The other group doesn't even bother with any evidence.
 
I didn't post any supporting evidence either, just what I believe to be a common realization.
 
There is actually evidence supporting your point. If a CEO is overpaid for the work he or she does, they're forced out and replaced by someone more expensive who is expected to generate more profits.
 
Deacon923 said:
I agree that there is overregulation, mainly at the state and local level with ridiculous licensing regimes that primarily protect incumbents and not consumers, and in the ridiculously complex federal tax code. Thats a different topic from whether the government is "too big" as a percentage of the economy (as if there is some magical number). I am for better and more efficient government, but do not buy into the fetish for smaller government for the sake of smaller government. The facts show that government is smaller now than 20 years ago, and the loss of millions of government jobs is a significant contributor to the hollowing out of the middle class in this country.
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Look at government spending, the number of regulations, the number of mandates. Government is getting more onerous all the time. It is too big.

spending-GDP-chart1.png
 
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