• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

The Islamic Dilemma

simosfrostyone said:
I thought we were talking about Islamic terrorism. Did you happen to notice how they killed all those people in Paris? Hint: it wasn't with knives.
Click to expand...

That one time that thing happened, so ignore everything else, right?
 
simosfrostyone said:
I thought we were talking about Islamic terrorism. Did you happen to notice how they killed all those people in Paris? Hint: it wasn't with knives.
Click to expand...

IT HAPPENED ONE TIME, SO LET'S THROW EVERYTHING ELSE OUT THE WINDOW.

ETA: What Ph said.
 
simosfrostyone said:
I thought we were talking about Islamic terrorism. Did you happen to notice how they killed all those people in Paris? Hint: it wasn't with knives.
Click to expand...

Is your point really, in all sincerity, that gun control measures in Europe don't work because the Paris terrorist attack happened?
 
Saying gun control doesn't work in Europe because of the Paris attacks is like saying seatbelts don't work because people die in car crashes. Gun control efforts are a necessary, if insufficient way of curbing gun violence.
 
simosfrostyone said:
I thought we were talking about Islamic terrorism. Did you happen to notice how they killed all those people in Paris? Hint: it wasn't with knives.
Click to expand...

I love this post and everything it stands for.

Simos is really making a strong late-year run for best poster of 2015.
 
TownieDeac said:
Is your point really, in all sincerity, that gun control measures in Europe don't work because the Paris terrorist attack happened?
Click to expand...

No in all sincerity I am saying that banning guns doesn't stop terrorist attacks, in Europe or anywhere else. There are a lot of guns in circulation and all gun control measures do is make it a bit harder to get them and move them around. Law abiding citizens won't have guns. Bad guys will. Not sure why this is so hard to understand. Parisians are not comforted by the fact that France has very strong gun laws. Making something illegal criminalizes it, it doesn't eliminate it, no matter how much you liberals wish that were the case.
 
simosfrostyone said:
No in all sincerity I am saying that banning guns doesn't stop terrorist attacks, in Europe or anywhere else. There are a lot of guns in circulation and all gun control measures do is make it a bit harder to get them and move them around. Law abiding citizens won't have guns. Bad guys will. Not sure why this is so hard to understand. Parisians are not comforted by the fact that France has very strong gun laws. Making something illegal criminalizes it, it doesn't eliminate it, no matter how much you liberals wish that were the case.
Click to expand...

This is such a stupid argument for so many different reasons.

Do you not think that by making guns "a bit harder to get and moving them around" it eliminates at least some people that would attempt to commit a crime of this nature?
 
Last edited:
So there's no point in dramatically reducing gun violence unless it can be eliminated?
 
simosfrostyone said:
No in all sincerity I am saying that banning guns doesn't stop terrorist attacks, in Europe or anywhere else. There are a lot of guns in circulation and all gun control measures do is make it a bit harder to get them and move them around. Law abiding citizens won't have guns. Bad guys will. Not sure why this is so hard to understand. Parisians are not comforted by the fact that France has very strong gun laws. Making something illegal criminalizes it, it doesn't eliminate it, no matter how much you liberals wish that were the case.
Click to expand...

It's weird, then, that the majority of European citizens still want harsher gun laws after this attack. Is the entire continent dumb, and you have it figured out?
 
Also, France has 31 guns per 100 people, the 11th highest gun ownership rate per capita on Earth.
 
The only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is making sure bad guys can get guns as quickly and efficiently as possible.
 
simosfrostyone said:
No in all sincerity I am saying that banning guns doesn't stop terrorist attacks, in Europe or anywhere else. There are a lot of guns in circulation and all gun control measures do is make it a bit harder to get them and move them around. Law abiding citizens won't have guns. Bad guys will. Not sure why this is so hard to understand. Parisians are not comforted by the fact that France has very strong gun laws. Making something illegal criminalizes it, it doesn't eliminate it, no matter how much you liberals wish that were the case.
Click to expand...

To what do you attribute the much lower levels of gun violence in Europe than the United States?
 
PhDeac said:
I don't think religion is a causal factor. I think it's simply a convenient justification and recruiting tool. Align yourself with a popular movement such as religion and it's easier to spread your ideology.
Click to expand...

yes... this is again one of the better posts about this. whole argument is framed incorrectly by westerners. i don't know much about it myself, other than islam isn't going anywhere and in the dark ages, when Christians were killing each other in droves, ancient arab states and ottomans in the near east were kicking ass on every scientific front and their was a brain drain from west and central europe to places like the ottoman empire and the levant, just as germany and subsequently all of europe experienced a brain drain leading up to and during WWII that greatly benefited the U.S.

there are still globally plenty of killings done by xtians, many posters just don't know or hear about it or worse ignore it/trivialize/even rationalize it..and our domestic terrorist threat (which is many times larger than the foreign one--has a heavy xtian component and a strong correlation to whites and nobody is freaking out about that.. nor do we blame our bible and our religion for these attacks.)

The common themes that are at play in the current, specific arab-islamic terrorism have more to do with economic hardship, politicial instability, familial instability, and overall way of life/societal destruction. The reason we lump these guys together is because of their religion (of which we see there are too many sects, just like xtians, to say they are all motivated by any one thing), but their common language, literature, heritage, geography and race are the actual foundations of their society, religion is secondary and a convenient rallying cry and justification.

If you think about ourselves..common language, literature, heritage, geography, and race are the foundations of our culture and our motives have to do with economic advantages, oil, oversized military, fear, bigitroy and xenophobia, etc.--not our religion which itself has had many, many more sects than 400 year old Islam ever has.
 
simosfrostyone said:
No in all sincerity I am saying that banning guns doesn't stop terrorist attacks, in Europe or anywhere else. There are a lot of guns in circulation and all gun control measures do is make it a bit harder to get them and move them around. Law abiding citizens won't have guns. Bad guys will. Not sure why this is so hard to understand. Parisians are not comforted by the fact that France has very strong gun laws. Making something illegal criminalizes it, it doesn't eliminate it, no matter how much you liberals wish that were the case.
Click to expand...

Have you ever been a criminal?
 
What makes a criminal a criminal? One who breaks laws? Which laws?

I speed every day, am I a criminal? Does that mean I'm going to get a gun and kill people?

The "bad guys will have guns" argument is flawed on so many different levels it's comical.
 
the people who make that argument throw empirical data out the window when staking out that position. So they must know something that we all don't know, right? I'm figuring this poster has keen insight into the minds of criminals, and possibly is one.

In the case of stricter gun controls - whatever they may be - this poster is certain that criminals will then feel empowered to see through their previously shelved plans of shooting more people.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top