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Saudi World Golf Tour 2022/2023 Thread

DJ's a great example of how well the US put together their teams/pairings this year. He's #2 in the world - previous captains would have just stuck their #1 and #2 guys together (Jordan and DJ) at least once, and certainly would have put him up in prime spots.

Instead he gets a virtual cakewalk first round matchup and a mid-round singles spot. Also sat out on Saturday morning for Snedeker, who won. I guarantee there was a lot of thought put into that - how he's not really a spotlight/energy guy and probably not ideal Ryder Cup material. Instead Reed gets vaulted to his "spot" and takes out Rory while taking 2 of 3 from the Stenson/Rose dynamo with a shaky Spieth.

Contrast that with Europe saddling Rory with Sullivan out of the gate, sitting Ballo and Wood for Kaymer on Saturday... European's got beaten on the course and in the planning rooms. Finally.
 
qcdeac said:
cville, why do you love the DJ/Koepka pairing so much? They were the only American team to lose Saturday afternoon and their score didn't beat any other American team during that session. Koepka was amazing with Snedeker. DJ was the only US player to go into Sunday with a losing record.
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Yeah, but it was a fantastic match. Birdies were flying back and forth both ways and they just came up short against an even more fantastic team of Rory and Pieters - exciting stuff compared to halving holes with pars and the occasional bogey. You don't just look at wins and losses but how these guys were playing. I mean, technically Moore did win a point yesterday, but that was because he was playing Westwood and otherwise would have lost to just about anyone else and played like crap all week. OTOH, Stenson/Rose played extremely well but lost to the Reed/Spieth juggernaut. I'd rather watch an epic match with great players counter punching other great players with birdies even if it means a loss than crappy play where someone has to win or tie at the end. Take Phil as an example. He and Fowler should have lost Friday because they were hitting the ball all over the place but they came out with a lucky win - but it was a crap match whatever the result. Also didn't play well early Saturday, but started coming on on the 2nd 9 Sat afternoon and was on fire Sunday in a great match with Sergio. He only got a halve out of that but he and Sergio lit the place up.
 
DCDeac said:
DJ's a great example of how well the US put together their teams/pairings this year. He's #2 in the world - previous captains would have just stuck their #1 and #2 guys together (Jordan and DJ) at least once, and certainly would have put him up in prime spots.

Instead he gets a virtual cakewalk first round matchup and a mid-round singles spot. Also sat out on Saturday morning for Snedeker, who won. I guarantee there was a lot of thought put into that - how he's not really a spotlight/energy guy and probably not ideal Ryder Cup material. Instead Reed gets vaulted to his "spot" and takes out Rory while taking 2 of 3 from the Stenson/Rose dynamo with a shaky Spieth.

Contrast that with Europe saddling Rory with Sullivan out of the gate, sitting Ballo and Wood for Kaymer on Saturday... European's got beaten on the course and in the planning rooms. Finally.
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DC, yup, we beat them on the course badly. But what could you have done differently if you're Clarke? My 1 point would have been to have played RCB once or twice more. But how can you possibly hide 6 guys? I guess the only other way would have been, after you find out on Friday that Kaymer, Westwood, Willett, Wood, Sullivan and Fitzpatrick all suck, then pair Rory/Pieters, Rose/Stenson. RCB/Sergio and 2 suck boys for both Saturday rounds and hope the suck boys get paired against Spieth/Reed so you have a good shot at the other matches. But you then still have 6 guys sucking ass on Sunday to deal with. I just don't think there is much you can do as a captain when you have that many guys sucking that much ass.
 
cville deac said:
Yeah, but it was a fantastic match. Birdies were flying back and forth both ways and they just came up short against an even more fantastic team of Rory and Pieters - exciting stuff compared to halving holes with pars and the occasional bogey. You don't just look at wins and losses but how these guys were playing. I mean, technically Moore did win a point yesterday, but that was because he was playing Westwood and otherwise would have lost to just about anyone else and played like crap all week. OTOH, Stenson/Rose played extremely well but lost to the Reed/Spieth juggernaut. I'd rather watch an epic match with great players counter punching other great players with birdies even if it means a loss than crappy play where someone has to win or tie at the end. Take Phil as an example. He and Fowler should have lost Friday because they were hitting the ball all over the place but they came out with a lucky win - but it was a crap match whatever the result. Also didn't play well early Saturday, but started coming on on the 2nd 9 Sat afternoon and was on fire Sunday in a great match with Sergio. He only got a halve out of that but he and Sergio lit the place up.
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Classic cville doing all he can to deride Phil. He and Rickie made 6 birdies in 17 holes in alt shot, but it was a "lucky win" and a "crap match whatever the result" and they "should have lost."
 
Only rule change I'd like to see at this point is one requiring every player on each squad to play at least once each day. That would force each captain to use all of their depth and would require some re-pairings that would be interesting.
 
DeacLaw05 said:
Only rule change I'd like to see at this point is one requiring every player on each squad to play at least once each day. That would force each captain to use all of their depth and would require some re-pairings that would be interesting.
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This isn't Little League. Is this Little League?
 
GPDeac said:
Classic cville doing all he can to deride Phil. He and Rickie made 6 birdies in 17 holes in alt shot, but it was a "lucky win" and a "crap match whatever the result" and they "should have lost."
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They were all over the frickin' course. And I did say he was on fire Sat afternoon and Sunday. What did I state that was not fact? My point was that you can play great and lose and play not so great and win depending who your opponent is. And I used Phil as an example because he wasn't hitting it well on Friday or early Saturday and was playing out of his mind later Saturday and Sunday. And his match with Sergio was epic, yet he only got a halve, and OTOH, he wasn't playing well Friday and got a win.
 
simosfrostyone said:
This isn't Little League. Is this Little League?
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Yes, although such a little league rule would have helped us in the 1980s to early 2000s when the Euros were top heavy but not deep. A few times I remembering them sitting a guy or 2 at the end of their bench the entire 1st 2 days and just bringing them out on Sundays. A more appropriate way to achieve the same goal would be to do it like the PC used to be and just have more matches each day, which forces you to play more folks. But given the current Euro make-up, they'd be crazy to agree to such a change. This Euro team was more like some of those old top heavy Euro teams except there were even more bad golfers at the end of their bench. As opposed to the last decade or so where they were mostly just better than us top to bottom.
 
cville deac said:
Was out of town for the weekend. Watched most of Sat and caught the replay of yesterday's singles on replay last night before falling asleep in the middle. That front 9 with Rory and Reed was some of the most amazing golf I've ever seen - and loved their smiles and fist bumps after they hit their bombs on 8. I also wouldn't mind seeing a RC where the matches were just Rory/Pieters v. DJ/Koepke and Spieth/Reed v. Stenson/Rose.

The major takeaway is that you can't hide 6 golfers. My only criticism of Clarke is that he should have played RCB more. The guy has had a great year and was 1 of the better Euros going into this thing, so with the weaker team, I would have gone in planning on playing him 4-5 times. But 4 of his RC rookies were no-shows, and Westwood and Kaymer were atrocious. Westwood is done. Kaymer is a funny player. I don't remember a multiple major winner who goes through the dry spells like Kaymer does. He had that collapse in the UAE last year and wasn't heard from the rest of the year. I wasn't expecting much from Wood, Sullivan or Fitzpatrick, and they didn't disappoint. Was surprised Willett sucked, but he went in with some bad karma from his brother, and he seemed affected by that. They need a talent infusion if they want to win on American soil in 4 years. Their top 6 guys played great and were in some epic matches, but their bottom 6 sucked horribly. I'm thinking guys like Beef, Lowry, Levy, Dubuisson, Noren and Wiesberger need to step it up and take some of these guys' places. Speaking of Dubuisson, WTF has happened to him? He looked like he was turning into a star but has dropped into oblivion. Maybe he's friends with Anthony Kim.

Our only player who sucked was Moore. Was hot and was supposed to be a good match play guy, but he gave JB no assistance and only got a freebie point by drawing Westwood on Sunday. Loved the Spieth/Reed team even more than 2 years ago, and loved the DJ/Koepka pairing for 4ball. And as I said going into this thing, Reed may be 1 of the most disliked players on tour, may have been a cheater in college and may have strange family issues, but you gotta love him in this event. He'll be a stalwart on the team for the next decade plus. And if this is any sign as to how these guys will handle the majors, you gotta think Reed, Pieters and Koepka will win at least a major or 2.
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John Daly say's "hi"! Also I wouldn't say Moore sucked at all...considering his late inclusion to the team. He manned up at the end and was so happy to see him get the clinching point after DJ missed his chance (way to miss a clutch 3 footer - thank God the cup was not on the line there). Fowler (who I still say did not deserve to be picked) didn't exactly cover himself with glory.....one reason DL3 sat him out for 2 sessions.
 
cville deac said:
DC, yup, we beat them on the course badly. But what could you have done differently if you're Clarke? My 1 point would have been to have played RCB once or twice more. But how can you possibly hide 6 guys? I guess the only other way would have been, after you find out on Friday that Kaymer, Westwood, Willett, Wood, Sullivan and Fitzpatrick all suck, then pair Rory/Pieters, Rose/Stenson. RCB/Sergio and 2 suck boys for both Saturday rounds and hope the suck boys get paired against Spieth/Reed so you have a good shot at the other matches. But you then still have 6 guys sucking ass on Sunday to deal with. I just don't think there is much you can do as a captain when you have that many guys sucking that much ass.
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Definitely a fair point, but their strategy just seemed off to me this year. I guess it's easy in hindsight to laugh at the Rory/Sullivan matchup when the Rory/Pieters combo was so dominant. But still... First wave gets Kaymer, Sullivan, AND Westwood? Just seems like they donked the first morning and never recovered. They needed a lead heading into singles and only sent one legit team out to kick off the Ryder Cup.
 
cville deac said:
Yeah, but it was a fantastic match. Birdies were flying back and forth both ways and they just came up short against an even more fantastic team of Rory and Pieters - exciting stuff compared to halving holes with pars and the occasional bogey. You don't just look at wins and losses but how these guys were playing.
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That's why I made sure to point out that DJ/Koepka's score was not better than any of the 3 other American teams in that session.

Koepka had a great Ryder Cup. I just don't see why you think he and DJ make a great pair.
 
qcdeac said:
That's why I made sure to point out that DJ/Koepka's score was not better than any of the 3 other American teams in that session.

Koepka had a great Ryder Cup. I just don't see why you think he and DJ make a great pair.
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Not necessarily for 4somes, but their 4ball match was 1 of the best played matches of the weekend even though they lost. Add in they're friends, and this is a duo I'd trot out there at least for 4ball a couple of times in 2 years. Plus, I think they'll be a solid pair on the road. DJ has had more slings and arrows to deal with than just about anyone else in today's game and just quietly goes about his business. These guys may not be the sharpest tools in the shed, but they're mentally tough, and I think they'll be 2 of our better golfers when we're on the road in 2 years and hearing it from the Euro crowd.

Texas, agree about Daly, but he's a destructive human being. Kaymer appears stable and well adjusted. He just plain disappears a lot more than guys like Stenson and Rose. Also agree about Fowler and Fowler really hasn't been impressive at the RC outside of 1 match in Wales and his beating Rose on Sunday. That said, our not so great performers this past weekend like Fowler, Johnson and Walker were still better than the bottom 6 Euros, and that was the real difference and why we won by 6 points.
 
Speaking of Fowler, he was the fiery guy in his first RC. Not so much now. And as for beating Rose, I think Rose was just one under. (Which makes his complaining about the easy hole positions pretty comical) Anybody on our team would have beaten Rose sunday. I find Foster's game underwhelming.
 
simosfrostyone said:
Speaking of Fowler, he was the fiery guy in his first RC. Not so much now. And as for beating Rose, I think Rose was just one under. (Which makes his complaining about the easy hole positions pretty comical) Anybody on our team would have beaten Rose sunday. I find Foster's game underwhelming.
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Foster's. Australian for Beer.

But yeah, Rickie was underwhelming. He plays his best when nothing is expected of him (2 years ago with the top 5's in majors) or when people talk shit about him (Players).

He got lucky in his matches and the one he didn't, he lost.
 
I saw this on the Facebook and had to drop it here. Sorry if Haas.

14520445_10208499869589069_9098411898819444399_n.jpg
 
W/r/t Kaymer, the chipping yips say "hello!" He and Tiger should go on a road trip to uncover the mystery behind the yips and undergo some type of meditational, spiritual healing to cure them.

Agree that it would have been hard for Clarke to find the right pairings with 6 rookies no matter what, especially with Westy playing like a yippy, somewhat washed up version of himself, Kaymer scuffling, Stenson playing somewhat hurt recovering from his knee ailment, thus making 5 matches a real chore for him (he was feast or famine and looked a bit tired on late Saturday & Sunday), and Willett getting witness protection treatment just because of his daffy, dim-witted brother's blog.

However, Clarke really messed up not using more of the Spanish Armada Redux and benching RCB when he should have played 4-ball in the afternoon. It would have been hard, but Westy probably even would have admitted if asked after the fact that he ought to have been benched. I'm really surprised DC didn't make Sergio/RCB his anchor match in the afternoon against Reed/Speith, thus allowing him to split Stenson and Rose to go with Sully & Wood, respectively, thus sitting Westy and Kaymer.
 
Ryder Cup experience is one of the most overrated ideas thrown around about constructing the team or making pairings. Didnt bother Koepka/Moore/Pieters/RCB this time. Didnt bother Reed/Spieth in 2014, didnt bother Nicolas Coelsarts in 2012, didnt bother JB or AK in 2008.

Westwood was the most experienced player on the European team (and one of their best ever) and he was awful. Kaymer won it for the Euros 4 years ago at Medinah.
 
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