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Lol at the new WakeWill campaign

DistrictDeacon said:
Professor's don't all have PhDs anymore
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My overall point here was that DistrictDeacon's grief about our teachers not having PhDs is unfounded because 1) Wake employs approximately the same percentage of part-time faculty as they did a decade ago, and 2) the PhD is not necessarily the terminal degree in all fields.

Wake's adjunct hiring practices do not appear, at least to me, to be of the same unacceptable type that is diminishing the quality of education at American Universities. Correct me if I am wrong here, but Wake's hiring someone like Pour, for instance, is not a reflection of a money-saving move to cheaper and contingent labor, but an effort to stock a new department with experienced professionals with real-world experience, even if they don't have PhDs.
 
wakephan09 said:
My overall point here was that DistrictDeacon's grief about our teachers not having PhDs is unfounded because 1) Wake employs approximately the same percentage of part-time faculty as they did a decade ago, and 2) the PhD is not necessarily the terminal degree in all fields.

Wake's adjunct hiring practices do not appear, at least to me, to be of the same unacceptable type that is diminishing the quality of education at American Universities. Correct me if I am wrong here, but Wake's hiring someone like Pour, for instance, is not a reflection of a money-saving move to cheaper and contingent labor, but an effort to stock a new department with experienced professionals with real-world experience, even if they don't have PhDs.
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So you're making the assumption that the qualifications and makeup of full-time faculty haven't changed in the last decade?
 
ITT: Wake was better when I was there!
 
DistrictDeacon said:
So you're making the assumption that the qualifications and makeup of full-time faculty haven't changed in the last decade?
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Yes. Because there are now more qualified applicants than ever in our country's history looking for academic jobs. I'd imagine that Wake's gradual rise in the rankings over the past twenty years hasn't diminished the quality of the teaching faculty either -- probably even the reverse.
 
wakephan09 said:
Yes. Because there are now more qualified applicants than ever in our country's history looking for academic jobs. I'd imagine that Wake's gradual rise in the rankings over the past twenty years hasn't diminished the quality of the teaching faculty either -- probably even the reverse.
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There has been no gradual rise the rankings over the past twenty years -- there has been a drop. When I applied in 1997, Wake was ranked #25 in USNWR. Wake is now ranked #27 in USNWR, tied with Tufts.
 
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I think Wake debuted at #25 in 1994 and has been between #25 and tied for #28 since.
 
PhDeac said:
I think Wake debuted at #25 in 1994 and has been between #25 and tied for #28 since.
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Minor point of clarification but I think Wake was #23 in like 2012 or 2013.

Has there been a school that has shot up or shot down in the rankings since USNWR first rated them?
 
wakephan09 said:
My overall point here was that DistrictDeacon's grief about our teachers not having PhDs is unfounded because 1) Wake employs approximately the same percentage of part-time faculty as they did a decade ago, and 2) the PhD is not necessarily the terminal degree in all fields.

Wake's adjunct hiring practices do not appear, at least to me, to be of the same unacceptable type that is diminishing the quality of education at American Universities. Correct me if I am wrong here, but Wake's hiring someone like Pour, for instance, is not a reflection of a money-saving move to cheaper and contingent labor, but an effort to stock a new department with experienced professionals with real-world experience, even if they don't have PhDs.
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Yep...totally agree. They are taking advantage of expertise in the region as a way of reaching out and building networks/collaborations. I don't see Wake hiring adjuncts as a way to save money. Collaboration is becoming more and more important. Wake doesn't want to isolate themselves.
 
texasdeac said:
Minor point of clarification but I think Wake was #23 in like 2012 or 2013.

Has there been a school that has shot up or shot down in the rankings since USNWR first rated them?
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Thanks. I doubt there's been much change for many schools at the top of the rankings. Maybe some movement between Tiers 3 and 4.
 
If Hatch can't get us into the top ten in the next three years, he has got to go !
 
Cam Newton took the Panthers from 1-15 (#32 team) to 15-1 (#2 team) in five years. Hatch is underperforming Cam Newton.

:cam:
 
wakephan09 said:
My overall point here was that DistrictDeacon's grief about our teachers not having PhDs is unfounded because 1) Wake employs approximately the same percentage of part-time faculty as they did a decade ago, and 2) the PhD is not necessarily the terminal degree in all fields.

Wake's adjunct hiring practices do not appear, at least to me, to be of the same unacceptable type that is diminishing the quality of education at American Universities. Correct me if I am wrong here, but Wake's hiring someone like Pour, for instance, is not a reflection of a money-saving move to cheaper and contingent labor, but an effort to stock a new department with experienced professionals with real-world experience, even if they don't have PhDs.
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Some departments at Wake absolutely will hire and retain adjuncts for extended periods of time for budgetary reasons over some altruistic need to restock the department with new professionals.
 
Liquid Karma said:
Some departments at Wake absolutely will hire and retain adjuncts for extended periods of time for budgetary reasons over some altruistic need to restock the department with new professionals.
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Short term fixes/solutions though I imagine. It's not the university model.
 
Liquid Karma said:
Some departments at Wake absolutely will hire and retain adjuncts for extended periods of time for budgetary reasons over some altruistic need to restock the department with new professionals.
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Since I figured you're talking about chemistry, I had a look at their faculty page. Looks like you're right, they even have an "adjuncts" category on the page. Very interesting. Neither of the two listed has a faculty profile, so I can't tell if they have terminal degrees or where they're coming from.

Furthermore, looks like there are also Visiting Professors (a position for which I've already criticized Wake in other threads) and "Teaching Professors" (I'm not sure exactly what they are). LiquidKarma, anything helpful you can tell us about the "Visiting Assistant Professorship" position? It it contract-based? It comes with a rank, which seems a bit unusual. I know you've talked a little bit about it before on here, but no worries if it's too personal.

As a general practice, this is bad. I wonder how many other departments are doing this? In the case of Chemistry, at least, District is correct.
 
wakephan09 said:
As a general practice, this is bad. I wonder how many other departments are doing this? In the case of Chemistry, at least, District is correct.
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I'm a bit confused. You accept the fact that 17% of the professors at Wake are adjunct but then are surprised when you find adjunct professors in a department????? I don't get it...they have to exist somewhere.
 
pourdeac said:
I'm a bit confused. You accept the fact that 17% of the professors at Wake are adjunct but then are surprised when you find adjunct professors in a department????? I don't get it...they have to exist somewhere.
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I've tried to make the distinction very clear between adjuncts with professional experience (e.g. "Professors of Practice," science faculty like Pour, or instructors in the business school) and adjuncts with terminal degrees and full qualifications brought on as contingent teaching labor in lieu of opening new tenure lines. The example in chemistry, as far as I can tell from the website, seems to point to the latter.

As you said earlier, that has not historically been Wake's model. You make a good point, though: in which departments are those part-time faculty situated?
 
wakephan09 said:
I've tried to make the distinction very clear between adjuncts with professional experience (e.g. "Professors of Practice," science faculty like Pour, or instructors in the business school) and adjuncts with terminal degrees and full qualifications brought on as contingent teaching labor in lieu of opening new tenure lines. The example in chemistry, as far as I can tell from the website, seems to point to the latter.

As you said earlier, that has not historically been Wake's model. You make a good point, though: in which departments are those part-time faculty situated?
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In making this distinction, which do you think is better ?
 
wakephan09 said:
I've tried to make the distinction very clear between adjuncts with professional experience (e.g. "Professors of Practice," science faculty like Pour, or instructors in the business school) and adjuncts with terminal degrees and full qualifications brought on as contingent teaching labor in lieu of opening new tenure lines. The example in chemistry, as far as I can tell from the website, seems to point to the latter.

As you said earlier, that has not historically been Wake's model. You make a good point, though: in which departments are those part-time faculty situated?
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What hasn't been done at Wake chemistry is use these guys to cut costs. Non-tenure positions have always been in the mix. In a department like chemistry tenured positions require research so they hire faulty that focus on teaching/organizing labs/etc. It's been that way for years, it's not something new and I don't think it's done to save money (which would be the "new" model). They do this to have good people for specific department roles. A lot of these non-tenured track in chemistry are filled by Wake grads too. The situations are probably department specific.

That said, there's a glut of US STEM grads and PhDs in general. 50% of science PhDs aren't working in their field or in science...worse in Europe. Heard that at EB 2 years ago. Another sobering fact below...in an article about importing foreign workers. There are lots of PhDs for hire. THAT model is broken.

"Nearly 75 percent of Americans with science, technology, engineering and math (STEM) degrees are not working in STEM fields, according to U.S. Census Bureau data, and only 3.8 million Americans with STEM degrees hold STEM jobs.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2016/02/24/l...gress-disney-is-not-an-anomaly/#ixzz41IJTW1t2
 
pourdeac said:
What hasn't been done at Wake chemistry is use these guys to cut costs. Non-tenure positions have always been in the mix. In a department like chemistry tenured positions require research so they hire faulty that focus on teaching/organizing labs/etc. It's been that way for years, it's not something new and I don't think it's done to save money (which would be the "new" model). They do this to have good people for specific department roles. A lot of these non-tenured track in chemistry are filled by Wake grads too. The situations are probably department specific.

That said, there's a glut of US STEM grads and PhDs in general. 50% of science PhDs aren't working in their field or in science...worse in Europe. Heard that at EB 2 years ago. Another sobering fact below...in an article about importing foreign workers. There are lots of PhDs for hire. THAT model is broken.

"Nearly 75 percent of Americans with science, technology, engineering and math (STEM) degrees are not working in STEM fields, according to U.S. Census Bureau data, and only 3.8 million Americans with STEM degrees hold STEM jobs.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2016/02/24/l...gress-disney-is-not-an-anomaly/#ixzz41IJTW1t2
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Thanks for this. Very different in my field except for the whole glut of unemployed PhDs thing. And that departments at research universities won't hire "Teaching-only" positions -- all faculty are expected to publish and teach.
 
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