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Shooting at an Orlando Gay Night Club

I'm all for admitting that we have an Islamic extremist problem but what is the solution? I think the left doesn't want to admit there is a problem because they don't have a solution, so it digs into their mantra of always being right. Conservatives admit we have a problem but have no solution. So the question remains what do we do? If the election is any indicator we aren't getting a solution anytime soon. As Hillary will probably call for more
Bombing and wars, and to think Trump is some tough guy he just wants to be isolationist and racist.

If we can agree that we have a problem (can we?), then the solution is work with the moderate elements of Islam to isolate and marginalize the extremes. That's necessarily going to involve some compromise of liberties (much like we are asking of law-abiding gun owners), but it should come with a considerable amount of reciprocal good will and security resources. I don't imagine moderate Islamic people of good will dislike the added security that would come from being able to identify threats---like jackasses who travel overseas and then return to commit acts of jihad, be it with a firearm or a household cooking appliance.
 
Put a stop to immigration from these countries unless the people are thoroughly vetted and hold secular beliefs that are compatible with western democracy. No more wackos. Go read the WaPo interview with the shooter's father. It will leave you scratching your head how this fucking idiot was ever allowed into the country to begin with and why he hasn't been sent back.

I hate when people make Nazi comparisons, but.....
 
sad, indeed. what about the other 5,865 killed and 12K+ injured in 2016 so far?

Why don't I give you this super-satisfying response of saying that I know several, hundreds even, moderate gun owners who just want the same things for their families that you want for yours, and I know for a fact that they haven't committed a mass shooting all year. #notAllgunowners, so there's no problem, right?
 
No short term solution for radical Islam. No short term solution for the gun problem either.

Because there's no short term solution for either doesn't mean we shouldn't take steps to fix them.
 
Is your solution for the government to seize over 100 million guns? How do you think that will go over?

Who said anything about mass seizure of firearms? lame canard

Off the top of my head:

A) ban the transfer of firearms, including inheritance
B) Offer buybacks
C) Seize weapons used in crimes
 
Is your solution for the government to seize over 100 million guns? How do you think that will go over?

Just saying you want a gun ban is all you need as a solution. You can then pivot to talking about how Christians are as bad as Muslims. Later, you can complain about how nothing ever gets done.
 
Our leadership (or in the alternative, current management) should confirm what we all know to be true: we (Earth) have a problem with Islamic fundamentalism, and that problem can no longer be paved over with euphemisms about work-place violence and #notallMuslims knee-jerk denials. I heard what the apologists said, but I also heard Courtney Love assure all of us she was sober on the Roast of Pam Anderson. At some point, evidence wins.

If the right is willing to talk and act (yet to be proven) about curtailing the privileges for all us based on the irresponsibility of a few of us, at the very least is the left at willing to talk (the prelude to action) about what privileges are on the table until we (Earth) get a handle on the Islamic problem? Grand bargains--the best kind--require compromise.

Ok, as someone who leans left - yes. There is an issue with a radical population acting in horrific ways under the belief that they're acting out their religion.

Ta daa! So then what? Seriously. What are you suggesting is the resulting action of this "grand bargain" when it comes to dealing with actual people?
 
Ok, as someone who leans left - yes. There is an issue with a radical population acting in horrific ways under the belief that they're acting out their religion.

Ta daa! So then what? Seriously. What are you suggesting is the resulting action of this "grand bargain" when it comes to dealing with actual people?

shoot them and throw away the guns?
 
No short term solution for radical Islam. No short term solution for the gun problem either.

Right, but you could implement a reasonable gun control policy tomorrow to begin making a dent in that problem.
 
Why don't I give you this super-satisfying response of saying that I know several, hundreds even, moderate gun owners who just want the same things for their families that you want for yours, and I know for a fact that they haven't committed a mass shooting all year. #notAllgunowners, so there's no problem, right?

OK? what does this have to do with a discussion of practical measures to address issues of gun availability and preventing gun violence?
 
Ok, as someone who leans left - yes. There is an issue with a radical population acting in horrific ways under the belief that they're acting out their religion.

Ta daa! So then what? Seriously. What are you suggesting is the resulting action of this "grand bargain" when it comes to dealing with actual people?

If we're willing to ask others to compromise all of our rights because of the irresponsibility of a few (this is what the left asks of the gun-owning right), is it not fair to ask the same in return (electronic surveillance of international communications, international travel lists, the nonsensical canard of subjecting octogenarian women in wheel chairs to the same random screening as MAMs traveling from Islamic countries on one-way tickets)?
 
If we're willing to ask others to compromise all of our rights because of the irresponsibility of a few (this is what the left asks of the gun-owning right), is it not fair to ask the same in return (electronic surveillance of international communications, international travel lists, the nonsensical canard of subjecting octogenarian women in wheel chairs to the same random screening as MAMs traveling from Islamic countries on one-way tickets)?

agree with all those measures for countering terrorism

now lets' talk about disaffected white people shooting children in schools with their mother's AR-15s. and gang gun violence. and toddlers shooting people.
 
OK? what does this have to do with a discussion of practical measures to address issues of gun availability and preventing gun violence?

I can't help you if you have limited your appetite for problems to:
a) domestic acts,
b) only involving guns.

With those blinders on, we would have been only able to get the jump on the Fort Hood shooter, the Orlando shooter, the Clarksville Tennessee shooter, the San Bernadino shooters and the Boston Bombers during the pursuit. We wouldn't have stopped all crimes involving only guns.
 
The FBI is saying that during their interview with him in 2013/14 said he was a member of Hezbollah. There are mortal enemies of ISIS and the opposing Muslim sect. It would be like saying you were a member of the KKK and the Black Muslims.

It's sounds like he was a wacko but had no real ties.
 
agree with all those measures for countering terrorism

now lets' talk about disaffected white people shooting children in schools with their mother's AR-15s. and gang gun violence. and toddlers shooting people.

What's the name of this thread?
 
um, boston bombing was a Bomb, not guns, just to be clear.

I keep asking you to suggest measures to reduce GUN VIOLENCE in the united states. pretty simple question. i've already suggested some measures. you cant' even respond to those.

what are you afraid of?

if your position is "I don't think our current access to guns is a problem" then just say that.
 
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