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Thread: Conference Expansion: USC and UCLA to the Big Ten?

  1. #1541
    Quote Originally Posted by thatguy2016 View Post
    That Alabama game at Duke was agreed to by David Shula. Nick Saban was not and is not interested in returning to Duke for an OOC game.

    Whether the SEC wants Duke is a different question, of course.
    I donít think Duke wants the SEC either- Way too elitist to want to be in that conference if Big10 is extending invites. NC State on the other hand would given an appendage to be in the SEC as would VT. Wake, GT, BC, Cuse are gonna be left out of musical chairs this round- what do people think about Pitt and LVille? Would they make sense in either conference? I think SEC for LVille and Pitt for Big 10 but again, Big Ten already has a flag in PA

  2. #1542
    I still think Duke & Carolina might stick together and sell themselves as a package deal, that rivalry is integral to both athletics programs.
    Draxx them sklounst

  3. #1543
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichDeac25 View Post
    That doesn't alter the fact that it's changed the game and schools are adjusting.
    You seem to be pretending this discussion doesnít center around how much media company execs decide to pay college presidents for the rights to broadcast games.

    I havenít seen any discussion about whether or not these Super Leagues will break off from the NCAA and have a new model of student-athlete that includes revenue or an enhanced form of NIL.

  4. #1544
    Quote Originally Posted by JKW385 View Post
    I donít think Duke wants the SEC either- Way too elitist to want to be in that conference if Big10 is extending invites. NC State on the other hand would given an appendage to be in the SEC as would VT. Wake, GT, BC, Cuse are gonna be left out of musical chairs this round- what do people think about Pitt and LVille? Would they make sense in either conference? I think SEC for LVille and Pitt for Big 10 but again, Big Ten already has a flag in PA
    Sucks to realize this, but every school in the conference except Wake can make at least a credible case for membership in the Big Two. Duke has hoops, their brand, UNC rivalry, and academic prestige. GT has the Atlanta market. BC has Boston market. Louisville has cash. Pitt is a geographic fit for the B10 and has tons of alumni. Obviously they're not all getting in but we're the only one who isn't even in the conversation. Tough times.

  5. #1545
    Quote Originally Posted by inspectah View Post
    Sucks to realize this, but every school in the conference except Wake can make at least a credible case for membership in the Big Two. Duke has hoops, their brand, UNC rivalry, and academic prestige. GT has the Atlanta market. BC has Boston market. Louisville has cash. Pitt is a geographic fit for the B10 and has tons of alumni. Obviously they're not all getting in but we're the only one who isn't even in the conversation. Tough times.
    Donít disagree with you that weíre worst draw either- but for this round of Alignment - I think Cuse, BC, and GT get left out. SEC already owns Atlanta market, and if there are 20 spots in each super conference - That means there are 8 spots left and thatís not including ND, Washington, Oregon, Cal, Stanford. Not enough chairs for everyone right now unless they start cutting schools. This doesnít mean they canít still get in 5 years from now but I think for time being - we wonít be only ones staying home from Senior Prom. What do we need to do to make cut next time? Think we gotta merge with Elon or High Point. Davidson would be my first choice but I donít think they need us.

  6. #1546
    Also sucks that none of this is merit-based. We punch above our weight all over the place. Wake would be a competitive addition to either conference in many if not most sports. However, we could be ranked in football, basketball, baseball, soccer, tennis, etc. and we wouldn't get a second look thanks to our small alumni base and small (and competitive) media market.

  7. #1547
    Quote Originally Posted by ipitytheblue View Post
    Also sucks that none of this is merit-based. We punch above our weight all over the place. Wake would be a competitive addition to either conference in many if not most sports. However, we could be ranked in football, basketball, baseball, soccer, tennis, etc. and we wouldn't get a second look thanks to our small alumni base and small (and competitive) media market.
    Agreed. Itís all about money, brand, and markets. I know football has punched above its weight for 20 years but sadly - gonna take a decade of winning - 9-11 games to change perception since we have historically been one of worst programs in FBS. We can do all we want in stadium upgrades, facilities, NIL, etc. but reality is we are never gonna fill up even a 60,000 stadium - itís gonna be a nice story and thatís it for majority of college world- not attractive for Mega Conferences unless we have ND or Miami level tradition as a small school.

    We have a ceiling in football that I would argue we have hit and Iím fine with that. Whatís really killed us as a brand in my opinion has been the disaster thatís been menís basketball last 10+ years. I would argue we were a more attractive brand for expansion in 2003-2004 than now because of the drop off in menís basketball. When you talk to people nationally- they associate WF with a historically good basketball program given the guys weíve put in the proís. We had a chance in 2003-2005 to take our program to the next level with a once in a generation player for us in CP3 and we didnít seize the moment. Since then, save a few weeks in 2008-2009 and 2017, weíve been a dumpster fire of a program. Had we capitalized in early 2000ís, we have become a bigger national brand and on the right side of this mega conference talks.

  8. #1548
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL68 View Post
    Alabama had the Wallace Wade connection.

    they do play at Vandy.
    ... for now they do.

  9. #1549
    Anybody venture a guess when this all shakes out given the GOR?

    Hoping Phillips can pull a rabbit out of the hat to keep all ND sports, plus football now, in the ACC to save our hides.

    Navy and ND to the ACC??

  10. #1550
    Quote Originally Posted by morrison2951 View Post
    Anybody venture a guess when this all shakes out given the GOR?

    Hoping Phillips can pull a rabbit out of the hat to keep all ND sports, plus football now, in the ACC to save our hides.

    Navy and ND to the ACC??
    If I was a betting man, I would say by start of 2022 football season - I donít see it happening in next week

  11. #1551
    Quote Originally Posted by ipitytheblue View Post
    Also sucks that none of this is merit-based. We punch above our weight all over the place. Wake would be a competitive addition to either conference in many if not most sports. However, we could be ranked in football, basketball, baseball, soccer, tennis, etc. and we wouldn't get a second look thanks to our small alumni base and small (and competitive) media market.
    Absolutely agree with the above.

    Also agree that the last ten years of men's bball have done irreparable damage to our rep. Unforgivable.

    I would put the chances of ND joining the ACC in FB at one percent or less. I mean, it has to be a foregone conclusion that they're moving to the B10, right? Anything else is basically malpractice on the part of their admin. There's no getting around the math. Would be willing to bet the decision's already been made and it's just a matter of prepping behind the scenes at this point. The only alternative scenario that seems plausible is that the GOR holds for another minute, the ACC manages to scoop up some combination of sexy PAC12 and B12 schools, and we renegotiate the TV rights. And I'm pretty sure even that wouldn't do it.

  12. #1552
    Quote Originally Posted by morrison2951 View Post
    Anybody venture a guess when this all shakes out given the GOR?

    Hoping Phillips can pull a rabbit out of the hat to keep all ND sports, plus football now, in the ACC to save our hides.

    Navy and ND to the ACC??
    Notre Dame is as good as gone and Navy does nothing.

    The only ďbig moveĒ left to play is to try to land some of the best leftovers from PAC 10 and Big XII. I doubt that works but is worth looking into.

  13. #1553
    Quote Originally Posted by inspectah View Post
    Absolutely agree with the above.

    Also agree that the last ten years of men's bball have done irreparable damage to our rep. Unforgivable.

    I would put the chances of ND joining the ACC in FB at one percent or less. I mean, it has to be a foregone conclusion that they're moving to the B10, right? Anything else is basically malpractice on the part of their admin. There's no getting around the math. Would be willing to bet the decision's already been made and it's just a matter of prepping behind the scenes at this point. The only alternative scenario that seems plausible is that the GOR holds for another minute, the ACC manages to scoop up some combination of sexy PAC12 and B12 schools, and we renegotiate the TV rights. And I'm pretty sure even that wouldn't do it.
    itís Big 10 or stay independent- CFP doesnít expire until 2024 I believe? What a coincidence - that lines up with UCLA, USC, Texas, OU join the Big 2. ND has 2 more years of mercenary status and they still have path to CFP- I bet they slowplay it to lever the deal up in 2024

  14. #1554

    Conference Expansion: USC and UCLA to the Big Ten?

    I totally agree that weíre the least desirable, but I think people are way overestimating Duke. Their own fanbase doesnít think theyíll be picked up. Basketball means nothing in this equation and very little outside of a certain area. This is why no one is jumping on Kansas, who makes a better overall argument for inclusion than Duke, whose football program is horrific and facilities are lacking, not to mention being a relatively small private school. Duke is stuck in the same bucket as us.

  15. #1555
    Quote Originally Posted by PhDeac View Post
    You seem to be pretending this discussion doesnít center around how much media company execs decide to pay college presidents for the rights to broadcast games.

    I havenít seen any discussion about whether or not these Super Leagues will break off from the NCAA and have a new model of student-athlete that includes revenue or an enhanced form of NIL.
    Then you haven't been reading the right things. There has been plenty of discussion that the NCAA is going to be defunct for football and possibly for basketball as well.

    You were really, really wrong on your NIL prediction ("Watch the worst thing that happens from this be that some female track and field athlete makes money off her TikTok.") and you're really, really wrong here on NIL's impact on conferences.

  16. #1556
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    Quote Originally Posted by awakegirl View Post
    I totally agree that weíre the least desirable, but I think people are way overestimating Duke. Their own fanbase doesnít think theyíll be picked up. Basketball means nothing in this equation and very little outside of a certain area. This is why no one is jumping on Kansas, who makes a better overall argument for inclusion than Duke, whose football program is horrific and facilities are lacking, not to mention being a relatively small private school. Duke is stuck in the same bucket as us.
    TITCR

  17. #1557
    We couldíve had a combination of Gonzaga and Villanovaís record in basketball over the last decade and it wouldnít mean shit. Weíd be in the exact same situation.

  18. #1558
    Average per game viewership 2021 season. 110 schools ranked. Here are the numbers for ACC. Regular season only.

    ND-9
    Clem-19
    FSU-25
    Miami-35
    UNC-36
    Louisville-50
    UVA-51
    Pitt-53
    WFU-55
    NCSU-56
    GT-61
    VT-62
    Cuse-77
    BC-83
    Duke-96

    Laugh at NCSU boys.

  19. #1559
    Quote Originally Posted by WakeForestRanger View Post
    Notre Dame is as good as gone and Navy does nothing.

    The only ďbig moveĒ left to play is to try to land some of the best leftovers from PAC 10 and Big XII. I doubt that works but is worth looking into.
    Who are the best of the rest? Letís assume Oregon, Washington, and ND are in big 10. Letís all assume we have no defections for now. I would say in this order:

    Big 12- Baylor, Kansas, WVU, Texas Tech, TCU, OK State, Iowa State, KState
    PAC 12- Arizona, Stanford, Cal, Colorado, Arizona State, Utah, Washington State, Oregon State

    Sadly, I donít think ACC has clout to get PAC 12 teams unless we can offer a package deal say to Stanford/Cal and Arizona/Arizona Stare to both come in that the Big 2 wonít.

    So letís focus on Big 12- WVU logistically makes most sense given their history with VT and Pitt but they arenít exactly a national brand save a few years from the RichRod teams. Kansas would be a bone to keep Duke/UNC and Baylor would be a nice addition - itís just a bigger WF with lesser academics.

  20. #1560
    Quote Originally Posted by Deacfreak07 View Post
    TITCR
    I donít think itís that Duke itself has that much more appeal than us - itís more that they have a rival 8 miles away that is on paper - most attractive team in the ACC not named Clemson for Big 2. They are more attractive than FSU or Miami at the moment in my opinion- not if those programs are back to early 2000ís form. UNC is gonna look out for Duke, State, and LOWF in that order

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