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Conference Expansion: Stanford, California and SMU Join the ACC

I think people generally watch their own conference's network. I doubt anybody outside an ACC fanbase could tell you who hosts the ACC Network studio show.
 
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College ADs and conference presidents may be in the process of killing the golden goose. With passive aid from the NCAA
 
So he admits up front that the major driver of this stuff is football and yet he somehow, with a straight face, claims that Duke is in the second tier of teams. Duke has academic prestige and basketball, but they couldn't have been any worse in football - pretty much forever. I don't follow the N&O but I suspect he's a Duke beat writer or Duke homer

I don’t disagree with that but Duke has historically been better at football than we have- though not by much. They are more attractive than we are for a mega conference due to basketball, academic prestige, and the UNC rivalry. I don’t agree with this notion Duke is the hardest football job in the ACC- it’s Wake. Like it or not - they are a national brand and have an easier time recruiting than we do- they’re recruiting nationally against Stanford and they tend to their fair share of NC kids. We’re getting there but not there yet. Oh yeah- and it doesn’t hurt they allow athletes to take half their classes at NCCU.
 
I don’t disagree with that but Duke has historically been better at football than we have- though not by much. They are more attractive than we are for a mega conference due to basketball, academic prestige, and the UNC rivalry. I don’t agree with this notion Duke is the hardest football job in the ACC- it’s Wake. Like it or not - they are a national brand and have an easier time recruiting than we do- they’re recruiting nationally against Stanford and they tend to their fair share of NC kids. We’re getting there but not there yet. Oh yeah- and it doesn’t hurt they allow athletes to take half their classes at NCCU.

Duke hasn't been better than Wake football in a long, long time.
 
They won the Coastal in 2013 when we were at our lowest point this millennia. They passed us 2012-2016 then we’ve been better since.
 
I don’t disagree with that but Duke has historically been better at football than we have- though not by much. They are more attractive than we are for a mega conference due to basketball, academic prestige, and the UNC rivalry. I don’t agree with this notion Duke is the hardest football job in the ACC- it’s Wake. Like it or not - they are a national brand and have an easier time recruiting than we do- they’re recruiting nationally against Stanford and they tend to their fair share of NC kids. We’re getting there but not there yet. Oh yeah- and it doesn’t hurt they allow athletes to take half their classes at NCCU.

Historically, so has Army.
 
Interesting insight from Herbstreit with a bad Wake Forest mention.

https://www.thedailyhoosier.com/kirk-herbstreit-cited-ius-football-facilities-to-highlight-why-ucla-and-usc-had-to-join-the-big-ten/

“I mean, Purdue’s facilities, Indiana’s facilities, Northwestern’s facilities, blow anybody in the Pac-12 out of the water,” Herbstreit said Mad Dog Unleashed on Sirius XM. “If you’re a recruit and you go on a trip to Bloomington, Indiana, you would be blown away if you saw the facilities in Indiana.”

Host Chris Russo pushed back on the notion that Indiana might have better facilities than USC and UCLA.

“The Indiana facilities are that much better than some of the facilities in the Pac-12?,” Russo asked.

“Yes, Northwestern, Indiana, Purdue, I’m talking about a lower tier, or what is perceived to be the lower tier level (of the Big Ten),” Herbstreit said. “Ohio State, Michigan, the big boys, Nebraska, forget about them, I’m talking middle of the road, lower tier because of that amount of money that is brought into the Big Ten.

“And you should see what the Arkansas and South Carolina facilities are (in the SEC). And then you’re gonna go on a recruiting trip to USC and you just left South Carolina, let alone LSU, Alabama, Texas A&M, Auburn, the big boys. I mean, if you go to South Carolina, and all of a sudden you go to USC, it’s night and day. It’s very, very hard to compete with what the SEC and the Big Ten are cranking out from a revenue standpoint.

“I think what’s going to happen is this new world is going to essentially be of about 50 to 55 to 60 teams. I don’t know who’s going to be involved in it. But I think that’s going to become what we know as Power Five, Division I college football. And then whoever’s doesn’t make the cut. You mentioned maybe an Arizona, maybe a Wake Forest, whoever it is, doesn’t make the cut and doesn’t get into this new world, that I think we’re going to find like MAC football: Miami, Ohio, Western Michigan, where do they go? Where does Conference USA go? Right?

“I think they’ll go into their own division. I think they’ll add a division. So you have Division I, and let’s call (the next one) 1A … They can create their own playoff. We have a playoff in 1AA and we have a playoff in Division III. So I think that world gets left out, they’re frustrated, their fans are mad. But everybody can’t go to the big, big world. They just can’t. Everybody can’t be involved. And so people are going to be really frustrated with this. And there’s nothing we can do about it.”
 
They won the Coastal in 2013 when we were at our lowest point this millennia. They passed us 2012-2016 then we’ve been better since.

Yeah, they had a couple good years, but Wake has been better overall since Spurrier. Winning the coastal is like being the tallest midget.

TV ratings, attendance and success for their football program isn't on the same planet as Wake right now.
 
Let's just go with the relegation model from P5 Division 1+ all the way down to Division 3
 
Clawson shit talking Herbie after making the ACC championship game last year was incredible.

Also if this doesn’t get figured out, and we make the ACC championship game again, then what? We going to be left out of the discussions after doing it again? I can’t wait for this season to start and start pounding some of these teams, and an SEC road game in September in what will likely be on ESPN is a great time to start.
 
Clawson shit talking Herbie after making the ACC championship game last year was incredible.

Also if this doesn’t get figured out, and we make the ACC championship game again, then what? We going to be left out of the discussions after doing it again? I can’t wait for this season to start and start pounding some of these teams, and an SEC road game in September in what will likely be on ESPN is a great time to start.

Why would Wake@Vandy be on ESPN?

It's already been announced. Nooner on SEC Network.
 
The B10 and SEC have been able to separate to become the Big 2 because of college football viewership patterns.
The Top 11 programs in terms of avg viewership are all B10 and SEC programs + ND.
College football viewership over indexes in 2 regions - the deep south (TX, LA, MS, AL, FL, GA, TN, SC) and the Midwest. It under indexes in the NE and most of the Plains and is sort of avg on the West Coast and Mid-Atlantic.

Those 2 conferences have most of the college football brands that bring eyeballs, so they have been able to be paid larger and larger sums of money. They also have the largest fanbases which creates alot of extra revenue that smaller schools can't match. tOSU's AD says they bring in over $100MM of revenue from 6 home FB games. Most of them also tend to be 'the school' in their states so they have alot of sidewalk fans which also brings additional revenue.

Every conference (both professional and college) have stronger and weaker programs - by definition you have to. The Big 2 are no different.

I think all this talk that the ACC is going to get picked apart and implode is very unlikely. People have been saying the ACC is going to fall apart for decades - it hasn't. It's not going to be part of the Big 2 as it lacks large schools with huge football fanbases.
But I think most fans are overreacting and over estimating how many programs will end up in the Big 2. IMO I think it is unlikely the 2 conferences will go over 40 schools combined. Could even be less. They will probably form their own championship in a few years after the CFP expires. I then expect the remaining members of the other P5 conferences to form their own championships. I think of it like HS athletics. There will probably be different classifications AAA, AA, A. AAA is the Big 2. AA is the P5 schools and maybe a handful of G5 schools. A is the rest of the FBS (mostly G5). All three tiers have their own structure, their own playoffs, their own contracts, their own rules.

The fact that both Washington and Oregon could be had by the B10 right now for basically nothing (free of GoR and exit fee constraints) and they have been told that B10 is not going to take them gives a sense of how much value you have to bring in order to get picked by one of those conference now. Very few additional programs will meet that bar. That bar could change in the future but right now it is really high. Also note that even with all the money they have neither TX nor OK have tried to challenge the B12's GoR and move to the SEC early. That makes me think it will not be easy for schools to get out where those exist.

Notre Dame is the one school that has a very interesting decision. They are the only school in the Top 10 of viewership that is not currently in the B10 or SEC. They have already signaled they plan on remaining independent for now. The big decision for them is likely going to come around 2025 (CFP expiring) and if the Big 2 do decide to break away and stage their own championships, will ND join the B10 to be part of that or will they be satisfied playing at the AA level for championships. I don't think it is a slam dunk decision. ND has consistently given up more money in order to remain independent and has talked about wanting to associate with like minded schools academically. If they decide down the road to spurn the B10 and effectively play in the AA tier than that tier becomes alot more valuable.

The B10 has all but signaled they are holding where they are until ND makes a decision and ND will not make a decision until the situation forces them to.
 
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