• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

Respect & Patriotism vs. Free Speech & Protest

CantStandYa

CantStandYa

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 5, 2014
Messages
4,495
Reaction score
241
So the Kaepernick thing - moreso all the scorching #hottakes coming from that bastion of truth, sports radio and sports media - got me thinking about the balance between being "respectful" in our ubiquitous patriotic displays, versus exercising your free speech right to protest said displays for a specific reason.

Depending on your point of view, where does the line get drawn? E.G.:

- Sitting for the anthem
- Burning the flag
- Refusing to recite the pledge of allegiance in school
- Politicians not wearing America pins
- Trashing the military - or at least the military industrial complex and our spending on it

What about things like trashing the President when you're abroad or voting against funding for Veterans Affairs? Aren't those on the same wavelength as the Kaepernick thing, just further up (or down) the spectrum?
 
i don't have a problem with Kaepernick's decision but I don' treally get the connection between protesting the Anthem and police brutality

flag pins are fucking dumb
 
Flag pins are dumb as is the pledge. I never said it in high school -- I stood but did not recite (shades of the Josh Howard jersey retirement controversy from the Scout board).
 
All of the above are fine, although flag burning is pretty agro, dont complain if you get beat up by CLT exburb living Carolina Panther fan rednecks if you do that.
 
This is a free country. That means that Kaepernick can sit down during the anthem if he wants. It also means that I and others are free to think he is an ignorant asshat for doing so. He has a viewpoint and can choose how he wants to express it. I can choose to cheer against him and his team from now on - or whatever.
 
I think patriotism to the extent that Americans go through is really stupid to begin with.

I fail to see how standing or not standing during a National Anthem is a slight to the military at all. Colin didn't give a shit about the military when he was doing that---offensively or non-offensively.

Just these conservatives and their need for PC safe spaces.
 
The level of nationalism America has right now in large segments of society is downright dangerous IMO.
 
It's amusing to me that so many see something like sitting during the anthem to be beyond the pale. People get upset over the most inane things.
 
Deadbolt said:
It's amusing to me that so many see something like sitting during the anthem to be beyond the pale. People get upset over the most inane things.
Click to expand...

I really think his explanation was what caused the uproar more than sitting during the anthem. He basically said that he would not show respect to the flag of a country that treated minorities so poorly.

Considering that country has afforded him the opportunity for great wealth with minimal effort (at least lately), he might have found a better way to voice his displeasure. With his dwindling talent he will have a hard time finding a job with another team.
 
Most of the criticism of Kaep is expressly for refusing to stand during the anthem. Most people complaining about this probably don't even know he said anything about it post-game.
 
knowell said:
I really think his explanation was what caused the uproar more than sitting during the anthem. He basically said that he would not show respect to the flag of a country that treated minorities so poorly.

Considering that country has afforded him the opportunity for great wealth with minimal effort (at least lately), he might have found a better way to voice his displeasure. With his dwindling talent he will have a hard time finding a job with another team.
Click to expand...

The fact that despite his wealth, fame, and success (on and off the field), he still can't get past the color of his skin and be seen as successful in a lot of peoples eyes is exactly why he making the point that he is.

i don't think the protest was especially well thought out, and also doesn't really do much aside from amplify divisions, but it is absolutely his right as an American, and one that people have been fighting for.
 
Wakeforest22890 said:
Most of the criticism of Kaep is expressly for refusing to stand during the anthem. Most people complaining about this probably don't even know he said anything about it post-game.
Click to expand...

Really? Anyone who is upset about it has definitely heard what he said.
 
scooter84 said:
Really? Anyone who is upset about it has definitely heard what he said.
Click to expand...

Well this is patently false based on a quick scan around the internet and watching tv for more than about 5 minutes.

To add on---this poll on Peter King's Twitter shows that 51% of people polled (out of nearly 10K) "support his right to sit during the Anthem". 49% don't even think he has a "right to sit", much less whether they agree with his reasoning behind it or not.

https://twitter.com/SI_PeterKing/status/770034437035810816?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

Of course there are people writing well-made arguments on both sides, but a lot of the commentary has come from people who didn't hear a word he said and instead are just upset about him not standing.
 
Last edited:
Deacsfan27 said:
The fact that despite his wealth, fame, and success (on and off the field), he still can't get past the color of his skin and be seen as successful in a lot of peoples eyes is exactly why he making the point that he is.

i don't think the protest was especially well thought out, and also doesn't really do much aside from amplify divisions, but it is absolutely his right as an American, and one that people have been fighting for.
Click to expand...

I don't think I follow the bolded? Do you think, or does he think, the color of his skin is affecting whether people see him as a success?
 
Deacsfan27 said:
Well this is patently false based on a quick scan around the internet and watching tv for more than about 5 minutes.
Click to expand...

So people are just pissed that he sat down without having any idea of why, or what he was protesting? That is not my experience, but whatever.
 
Deacsfan27 said:
The fact that despite his wealth, fame, and success (on and off the field), he still can't get past the color of his skin and be seen as successful in a lot of peoples eyes is exactly why he making the point that he is.

i don't think the protest was especially well thought out, and also doesn't really do much aside from amplify divisions, but it is absolutely his right as an American, and one that people have been fighting for.
Click to expand...

No doubt it is his right and anyone who does not understand that does not understand what America is supposed to stand for. There are natural consequences to angering droves of people with a poorly thought out gesture.

I take issue with your characterization that people were not seeing him as a success. When he was playing well, no one was talking about the color of his skin.
 
scooter84 said:
So people are just pissed that he sat down without having any idea of why, or what he was protesting? That is not my experience, but whatever.
Click to expand...

Yes, welcome to America---where people have a right to be upset and angry and uniformed and uneducated.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top