• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

2017 NBA Draft thread - JC drafted 19th to Atlanta, OUR... Hawks?

FckVwls said:
I really like Zhaire and everything I have read/seen on him. More risk but a higher upside wing than the two Bridges I think
Click to expand...

I agree. But I disagree on Luka. I would be comfortable taking him at #3 however, but honestly when I watch his take he looks about as good as Mario Hezonja who was drafted in the first round by Orlando several years ago and has been just okay. He does have good vision, but I think if he played college basketball last year, he'd be a mid lottery pick.
 
jaybone said:
My God. It really was. Some years I am really awful at this.

This year, if you have the #2 pick and you DON'T either take Bagley or trade it for comparable value, I think you are making a mistake. I honestly haven't seen enough of Ayton to really have a strong opinion, but those who see him are so sure he's an NBA stud I am not going to argue him going #1, but when a kid comes in with an NBA game and body (think Tatum), and he falls down the board ahead of Euros and various high ceiling / low floor guys, I don't get it. Marvin Bagley essentially dominated games as a college freshman while playing a college game he is less equipped to excel in than the pro game. If you don't take him #2, you are going to look the fool by about game 40 next year.
Click to expand...

Agree.

I like Bagley over Ayton as I don’t see Ayton being as good as Cousins, Davis or Embiid. Something is off about Ayton imo.

Bagley is so young and pre-injury was dominating. Except of course head to head vs....Doral Moore!
 
jaybone said:
I agree. But I disagree on Luka. I would be comfortable taking him at #3 however, but honestly when I watch his take he looks about as good as Mario Hezonja who was drafted in the first round by Orlando several years ago and has been just okay. He does have good vision, but I think if he played college basketball last year, he'd be a mid lottery pick.
Click to expand...

They’re really different players. Completely different even.
 
I thought Hezonja was going to be awesome, so was wrong on that

But Doncic took a leap forward in Euro ball that Mario never took before the NBA draft

Doncic put up 15 pts / 5 boards / 5 assists this season in 25 mins a game against grown ass men
 
Post some mixtapes to sell me on Luka. He looks good in what I've seen, but not a #1 or #2 over Ayton or Bagley.
 
PhDeac said:
Post some mixtapes to sell me on Luka. He looks good in what I've seen, but not a #1 or #2 over Ayton or Bagley.
Click to expand...

fwiw i don't know that i'd take him over ayton or bags but he looks like he's gonna be real good





 
buckets said:
I thought Hezonja was going to be awesome, so was wrong on that

But Doncic took a leap forward in Euro ball that Mario never took before the NBA draft

Doncic put up 15 pts / 5 boards / 5 assists this season in 25 mins a game against grown ass men
Click to expand...

Hezonja had a decent comeback season on a horrible team, but he’s clearly a stretch 4/5 at this point vs. the wing prospect that made him a can’t miss lotto pick.
 
I’m less sold on MBIII. His defense looked pretty meh (as much as you can tell in a zone) and he seemed a touch soft at times. He still might an all-NBA type but I do t think he’s surefire perrenial all-star.
 
I think people are overthinking Bagley. He’s got a high floor.
 
Hezonja was a toolsy projection coming out of Barca. I think he barely played his first season and then was a limited bench player year 2. Luka is 15/5/5 at Real Madrid as a teenager. He's playing against much tougher competition than in the NCAA.

Doncic has off the charts basketball IQ and intangibles. Easily the highest floor in the draft due to his high level production at Madrid. And he's a perfect player type for the modern NBA. Can do it all.
 
FckVwls said:
Hezonja was a toolsy projection coming out of Barca. I think he barely played his first season and then was a limited bench player year 2. Luka is 15/5/5 at Real Madrid as a teenager. He's playing against much tougher competition than in the NCAA.

Doncic has off the charts basketball IQ and intangibles. Easily the highest floor in the draft due to his high level production at Madrid. And he's a perfect player type for the modern NBA. Can do it all.
Click to expand...

Just not particularly quickly though. Ricky Rubio was this kid 10 years ago and he has been a fine middle tier of worth a mid round pick.

This kid may end up being all you and rj say, he just doesn't look very fast. I'd take Anton or Bagley if I had the first or second pick and I wouldn't hesitate.

Numbers are numbers. I remember when we all were calling the beard a short 3 or a slow 2 - ignoring his insane numbers at ariz state.

That said if Lula can get to 15/5/5 in the NBA that is more than solid. That is Ben Simmons lite
 
jaybone said:
I agree. But I disagree on Luka. I would be comfortable taking him at #3 however, but honestly when I watch his take he looks about as good as Mario Hezonja who was drafted in the first round by Orlando several years ago and has been just okay. He does have good vision, but I think if he played college basketball last year, he'd be a mid lottery pick.
Click to expand...

Doncic has been the best player in the EuroLeague this season, and the teams in that league would beat even the best college basketball teams into the stone age. Mario Hezonja was a prospect who had top notch athleticism and played a few minutes a game (15.4mpg, 5.8ppg). Doncic is the best player on maybe the best team in Europe, winning monthly MVP honors multiple times and utterly dominating the league. They are not even comparable in terms of their progression to this point.

He would have put up 28-8-5 in the ACC this year and would be regarded as the surest thing #1 pick since at least the Brow.
 
vadimivich said:
Doncic has been the best player in the EuroLeague this season, and the teams in that league would beat even the best college basketball teams into the stone age. Mario Hezonja was a prospect who had top notch athleticism and played a few minutes a game (15.4mpg, 5.8ppg). Doncic is the best player on maybe the best team in Europe, winning monthly MVP honors multiple times and utterly dominating the league. They are not even comparable in terms of their progression to this point.

He would have put up 28-8-5 in the ACC this year and would be regarded as the surest thing #1 pick since at least the Brow.
Click to expand...

Okay if you say so. That is quite the projection though. Quite the projection. What I do know with my limited basketball knowledge is how to read stat sheets and while you can project Doncic to post never before seen ACC stats of 28-8-5. I mean those numbers have NEVER been seen by Michael Jordan, much less a first year player. However, Bagley DID score 21/11 his one season at Duke against ACC competition with a tough OOC schedule as well. Those numbers actually happened. So if I have a hole in the 4 spot or an average NBA player there and I have the #2 pick, I am jumping on him.

If I need a Ben Simmons type point forward, then I am sure I consider Doncic, but not because I project him out to 28/8/5 compared to what Bagley did at Duke in the ACC or because Doncic did get 15/5/5 against grown men in Europe, but rather, because he fills a need and he will likely be really good.

I still strongly expect him to struggle with his lateral speed, however. Lonzo Ball suffers the same problem, only worse. So, if Doncic can exceed Ball by about 20%, he'll be worth a #3 pick.
 
15/5/5 (and the per 48 is disgusting as well) in the EuroLeague >>>>>>>>>>> any stats in the ACC. Your bias is in the wrong direction. The bottom tier teams in ACB have NBA players (CB Sevilla is bottom of the league and has Ryan Kelly and others on it - the teams up the table are loaded with talent) who are grown men, with focused coaching, game plans, no classes, real professional training and diet, etc. They would utterly wipe the floor with any ACC team. Madrid has guys like Rudy Fernandez who played years in the NBA who come off the bench (Doncic has forced him to the bench, basically).

For a 19 year old to be the best player on the best team in Spain is unheard of. Bare minimum - if he improves not a single bit - he will be an above average NBA starter. That's how good he is RIGHT NOW.
 
Last edited:
Other thing about Doncic - he started (at age 18) for the EuroBasket champions when Slovenia won the title last summer. That Slovenia team is basically Dragic, Doncic and Anthony Randolph and they beat Spain by 20(!) in the semi-final and then Serbia in the final. In the semi-final against Spain an 18 year old Doncic played a team high 35 minutes, almost had a triple double (11/12/8) and was +20 while on the court. And that Spain team had Pau and Marc Gasol, Ricky Rubio, the Hernangomez brothers, etc.

I don't think the average American fan realizes how high level European basketball has become, and how ridiculous it is for an 18-19 year old to be doing what Doncic is. Dude is a spectacular talent.
 
vadimivich said:
15/5/5 (and the per 48 is disgusting as well) in the EuroLeague >>>>>>>>>>> any stats in the ACC. Your bias is in the wrong direction. The bottom tier teams in ACB have NBA players (CB Sevilla is bottom of the league and has Ryan Kelly and others on it - the teams up the table are loaded with talent) who are grown men, with focused coaching, game plans, no classes, real professional training and diet, etc. They would utterly wipe the floor with any ACC team. Madrid has guys like Rudy Fernandez who played years in the NBA who come off the bench (Doncic has forced him to the bench, basically).

For a 19 year old to be the best player on the best team in Spain is unheard of. Bare minimum - if he improves not a single bit - he will be an above average NBA starter. That's how good he is RIGHT NOW.
Click to expand...

TITCR
 
vadimivich said:
15/5/5 (and the per 48 is disgusting as well) in the EuroLeague >>>>>>>>>>> any stats in the ACC. Your bias is in the wrong direction. The bottom tier teams in ACB have NBA players (CB Sevilla is bottom of the league and has Ryan Kelly and others on it - the teams up the table are loaded with talent) who are grown men, with focused coaching, game plans, no classes, real professional training and diet, etc. They would utterly wipe the floor with any ACC team. Madrid has guys like Rudy Fernandez who played years in the NBA who come off the bench (Doncic has forced him to the bench, basically).

For a 19 year old to be the best player on the best team in Spain is unheard of. Bare minimum - if he improves not a single bit - he will be an above average NBA starter. That's how good he is RIGHT NOW.
Click to expand...

Dude, your Ryan Kelly example is NOT doing you any favors. He is averaging 14.5 pts per game in the top Spanish league but never averaged more than 12 per game in the ACC (and that was 4 years in). His minutes comparison are dead equal. I am not saying the Spanish league sucks or lacks the talent of the ACC - I am just saying that using your example, the Spanish league is actually EXACTLY comparable to the ACC, possibly a tick less talented.

We are all going to have to wait and see. This time last year, I am sure I could have been goaded into how much a tweener Donovan Mitchell was going to be. Afterall, he came to Winston his senior year and laid a fucking a egg against us.

My takeaway actually is that in this draft, if you have the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd pick, you are going to spluge in your shorts. You are guarnteed a can't miss pick who could develop into an NBA top 15 player
 
I think the draft is Doncic and then everyone else. And it's not close, imo. He's a spectacular, future MVP level player. Best European player since Nowitski and a Hall of Fame talent. This is a Lebron, AD, Ben Simmons type draft where the #1 pick is worth the next 2-3 picks combined (or more).
 
jaybone said:
Dude, your Ryan Kelly example is NOT doing you any favors. He is averaging 14.5 pts per game in the top Spanish league but never averaged more than 12 per game in the ACC (and that was 4 years in). His minutes comparison are dead equal. I am not saying the Spanish league sucks or lacks the talent of the ACC - I am just saying that using your example, the Spanish league is actually EXACTLY comparable to the ACC, possibly a tick less talented.
Click to expand...

27 year old Ryan Kelly after having spent 4 years in the NBA would put up 25 a night in the ACC. Maybe 30. You're talking about a grown ass man with hundreds of professional basketball games and countless hours under his belt against kids with around 50 games or less playing any real form of organized competitive sport.

Objectively, college basketball kind of sucks. It's a pretty low level of the sport played by youngsters with limited coaching time and other responsibilities. Nearly any major pro league in the world is substantially better. Doesn't mean it is not fun, just means it is not objectively very good or even a very good basis to learn to how talented (or not talented) players are at that age.
 
you may be right, vad, but you go hard for all things Euro to the point where I can't take your word for it
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top