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Pop's brilliance about race.

Jhmd,

I'll save you the time of typing your diatribe on how the welfare state is creating dependency in these communities and must be removed so that individuals will have an easier time making the choices you suggest. I'll concede the point for the sake of argument.

Why not remove other barriers to making those choices, like systemic racism?

We all understand that an individual is unlikely to be able to change the systemic racism that is holding them back so they are better off focusing on making the best choices available to them. But surely through collective action we can address what you seem to agree is a major problem preventing certain communities from making the choices you propose.

For instance...
 
Once again, these protests are not really meant to change white conservatives minds, they are a public demonstration of resistance meant to encourage the oppressed and abused.
1919f6a2240d8fc6579b9e761e96aa4a.jpg
 
1. Undisputed prejudices (historical and present) present inequitable result.
2. Well-intended policies create a public resource that chases out private responsibility (a widely-observable phenomenon) which impacts community subject to #1 at disproportionate rate, creating secondary explosion of family unit, compounding damage from #1.

See #1.
 
Uhh systemic racism. The "past and present prejudices" that you admitted two pages ago contributed to the racial disparity in who makes the choices you so frequently recommend. Can we focus on removing that?

I'm not asking what to remove, but how? How do you propose to change the feelings over other people?

My proposal is to prove them wrong. You know how you do that? I'll give you three guesses...
 
I'm not asking what to remove, but how? How do you propose to change the feelings over other people?

My proposal is to prove them wrong. You know how you do that? I'll give you three guesses...

Why don't we start with an equitable treatment of minority communities with in the public school system?
 
I'm not asking what to remove, but how? How do you propose to change the feelings over other people?

My proposal is to prove them wrong. You know how you do that? I'll give you three guesses...

Your position is that you can't change a racist's mind (false) so just be really successful and prove them wrong? wrong about what? Until they change they don't care about successful black people any more than they do unsuccessful black people. good lord, man, this is the poorest argument I have ever heard in my life.

They are still racist. In your scenario, no amount of wealth or success will stop a racist cop from gunning them down or beating them over the head or covering up for other racists who are violent towards them. You think the black plumber with a wife and kids and a mortgage is immune from racism?

You live in some lily-white fantasy world. Did your parents teach you this shit?
 
and btw, systemic racism isn't about feelings, it's about purposefully disadvantaging people through public structure (i.e. the way the country was built). Working toward a more just society isn't just about conversation, understanding, and repairing relationships between people. It's fixing unjust structures. Let's start with criminal justice reform and education - valuing equity in these two areas will go a long way toward alleviating the problems that you point to as causes of inequality (which are the result of both personal decisions and of a racialized society - and you can haggle over percentages if you'd like)
 
No, no, no. Not supports. Just defends everything he does. And brags about winning the election.

There is a simple reason for all of jhmd's twisting and contorting arguments about race and entitlements and the environment and reaason for living and everything else, and his support for Trump (sure you didnt vote for him):

https://www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/opinions/wp/2017/09/28/want-to-know-why-the-gop-elites-have-put-up-with-trump-now-you-know/

Yes, of course, any Republicans who still have the capacity for embarrassment are embarrassed by President Trump. Embarrassment is an easy virtue. It resides in the tut-tut category of social niceties. The wealthy do not prefer to think of themselves as tawdry, and well, just what is to be done about that Trump fellow?

Well, nothing is to be done about that Trump fellow. Not just yet anyway. Because while a few Republicans may have a lingering susceptibility to embarrassment, none still have the capacity for shame. They have made their deal with the Donald, and the deal is the deal that they will make with anyone. Tax cuts for the rich. And this week … voilà!

This ongoing, gnawing, single-minded lust for more money lies at the root of it, of course. If you need an organizing principle to explain all the many peculiar and nasty elements of the GOP donor class, it is this unquenchable need for still-greater riches that ties it all together, from their comfort with outright dishonesty to their willingness to vacillate wildly on so-called matters of principle, such as concern about deficits and respect for the mechanisms of democratic government. They are even willing to preside over the disintegration of the Republican Party as a serious, viable political entity if that's what it takes to eke out one final tax cut, in what is looking like their last, best chance to get it.

And after laying waste to the executive branch, to civilized behavior, to global leadership, to the health and stability of the environment, Trump at last stands there, with their tax cuts in hand. As they knew he eventually would. Heck, his facility at lies and distraction might even be an asset here. Definitely worth all the risks to the nation to find out.

So tote up the features of this tax cut. It is based on a now long-discredited "theory" about tax cuts paying for themselves, standing atop pillars of nonsense about how it will affect the economy, cross-braced with fabricated assurances about whom it benefits, and wrapped in a cloak of vagueness that will not be lifted, it is hoped, until the deed is nearly done. And the consequences? They get their money, and you get to worry about those consequences.

If the result is a broken government without sufficient resources or comity or honest, dedicated people left to act in the interests of the broader public interest ever again, so much the better. Because the other idea they like almost as much as tax cuts for themselves is a crippled, withered government. Because at the end of their day, those are practically the same thing.
 
There is a simple reason for all of jhmd's twisting and contorting arguments about race and entitlements and the environment and reaason for living and everything else, and his support for Trump (sure you didnt vote for him):

https://www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/opinions/wp/2017/09/28/want-to-know-why-the-gop-elites-have-put-up-with-trump-now-you-know/

I did not vote for President Trump. You need to grow your brain a little larger to understand that there are more than two ways to think about things. There is more out there than your opinion and the other one. Think harder.

The reason for my argument about race and entitlement is pretty simple: I'm right. https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/...teens-should-follow-to-join-the-middle-class/

Our research shows that of American adults who followed these three simple rules, only about 2 percent are in poverty and nearly 75 percent have joined the middle class (defined as earning around $55,000 or more per year).

If your plan (generic self-flagellation to an unspecified end) had a 98% success rate, I would support it. It doesn't, though. Mine does. Welcome to math, rube.
 
If you cared 1/100th as much as you claimed you did about this foolproof plan you'd probably support policies that make it easier for people to execute it

For example, opposing those policies that people use as an alternative to execution. I would. I do.
 
I did not vote for President Trump. You need to grow your brain a little larger to understand that there are more than two ways to think about things. There is more out there than your opinion and the other one. Think harder.

The reason for my argument about race and entitlement is pretty simple: I'm right. https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/...teens-should-follow-to-join-the-middle-class/

Our research shows that of American adults who followed these three simple rules, only about 2 percent are in poverty and nearly 75 percent have joined the middle class (defined as earning around $55,000 or more per year).

If your plan (generic self-flagellation to an unspecified end) had a 98% success rate, I would support it. It doesn't, though. Mine does. Welcome to math, rube.

LOL dude you are embarrassing yourself. Just stop. It's really bad lately.

I don't have to tell you or anyone reading that no one is disagreeing with that report or those three things. You know it. And you know the discussion is not about that.

Seriously, you've become this one-dimensional broken record. Are you drinking too much? work stressing you out? or are you just that big of a coward?
 
Im going to go with coward. You are just the person Pop was talking about in the interview. Youre scared. come on out, its ok
 
I'm not asking what to remove, but how? How do you propose to change the feelings over other people?

My proposal is to prove them wrong. You know how you do that? I'll give you three guesses...

You are confusing individual choices and feelings with societal action.

We can start by not electing self-declared racists. We can reform a justice system that is systemically racist. We fix an economic system that is systemically racist. We can try and remedy the negative effects of past discrimination.

And it's not even true that you can't influence an individual's feelings or choices. We can, through education and societal pressure, make people less racist. In the exact same way that we can, through education and societal pressure, make people more likely to make healthy choices.
 
I did not vote for President Trump. You need to grow your brain a little larger to understand that there are more than two ways to think about things. There is more out there than your opinion and the other one. Think harder.

The reason for my argument about race and entitlement is pretty simple: I'm right. https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/...teens-should-follow-to-join-the-middle-class/

Our research shows that of American adults who followed these three simple rules, only about 2 percent are in poverty and nearly 75 percent have joined the middle class (defined as earning around $55,000 or more per year).

If your plan (generic self-flagellation to an unspecified end) had a 98% success rate, I would support it. It doesn't, though. Mine does. Welcome to math, rube.

It's. Not. A. Plan.

And it's certainly not yours.
 
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