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Biggest Reform EVER passed thread

I would guess your average working class American gets a 2-3% raise annually if any at all. That’s not a small amount to them. The bill is bullshit and a cash grab for rich donors, but don’t think that those crumbs would be helpful and appreciated by working class folks. The GOP will likely be successful in marketing any loss of service as “Obamacare” or “gub’ment inefficiency”, and the rubes will believe them.

Just wait until year 2!
 
smoke and mirrors


at least when the Dems fuck up their numbers some poor kid with cancer gets some insurance out of it.

Pubs are just soulless bloodsuckers. sheesh
 
smoke and mirrors


at least when the Dems fuck up their numbers some poor kid with cancer gets some insurance out of it.

Pubs are just soulless bloodsuckers. sheesh

I'm just happy that the working class real americans like myself that struggles on a daily basis are no longer subsidizing the liberal elites in their $500,000 homes like yourself.
 
There are a few people that get hurt which bring down the average. Median and mode. Most people save around 3%. (Which is obvious , the bracket goes from 15% to 12% or 25% to 22%, etc.)

Your numbers are still wrong, but that's not really the point. Even if we conceded everything you arguing: that we should only look at the people getting a tax break and ignored the "few" (millions of) working class people getting no relief or a tax hike; even if we assume that those getting a break are getting around 3%; even if we ignore that that the cuts are less meaningful over time due to other provisions in the bill; even if we assume Congress will eventually make the individual cuts permanent making the 8-10 year numbers less damning - all of that could be true and the bill would still be AWFUL.

The "most people get more in their paycheck so this should be getting more support" argument completely ignores the fact that we don't have infinite money. This costs $2.2 trillion dollars (if the cuts are made permanent), which everyone should agree is not sustainable, and no analysis, even from the right leaning think tanks, has shown that the cuts will come close to paying for themselves. That money has to come from somewhere, and it will, whether it starts this year with mandated big cuts to Medicare and other programs via Paygo, Medicaid/SS/entitlement programs cuts to be introduces soon, some silly clawback provision that raises taxes when fairy tale revenue targets aren't met, or the eventual expiration of the cuts in 2025, or some combination of the above, it will happen. And wherever the money comes from, I'm confident it will disproportionately hurt the lower and middle classes. There are other things that are terrible about the bill (premiums going up 10%, crippling graduate education, etc) any of which could be reasonably considered disqualifying, but it doesn't matter because we can't pay for it.
 
Your numbers are still wrong, but that's not really the point. Even if we conceded everything you arguing: that we should only look at the people getting a tax break and ignored the "few" (millions of) working class people getting no relief or a tax hike; even if we assume that those getting a break are getting around 3%; even if we ignore that that the cuts are less meaningful over time due to other provisions in the bill; even if we assume Congress will eventually make the individual cuts permanent making the 8-10 year numbers less damning - all of that could be true and the bill would still be AWFUL.

The "most people get more in their paycheck so this should be getting more support" argument completely ignores the fact that we don't have infinite money. This costs $2.2 trillion dollars (if the cuts are made permanent), which everyone should agree is not sustainable, and no analysis, even from the right leaning think tanks, has shown that the cuts will come close to paying for themselves. That money has to come from somewhere, and it will, whether it starts this year with mandated big cuts to Medicare and other programs via Paygo, Medicaid/SS/entitlement programs cuts to be introduces soon, some silly clawback provision that raises taxes when fairy tale revenue targets aren't met, or the eventual expiration of the cuts in 2025, or some combination of the above, it will happen. And wherever the money comes from, I'm confident it will disproportionately hurt the lower and middle classes. There are other things that are terrible about the bill (premiums going up 10%, crippling graduate education, etc) any of which could be reasonably considered disqualifying, but it doesn't matter because we can't pay for it.

If we can spend $10 trillion on the war in Afghanistan, we can spend $2 trillion on saving most of us a couple hundy a month. Heck, we almost wasted 25% of the amount you're talking about in shady Puerto Rican rebuild efforts. I'm fine cutting taxes, then maybe the government can start being frugal.
 
To be fair, the main joy that Trump supporters will get from this being passed has almost nothing to do with the meager (if any) tax breaks they'll get from it. Instead, it will come from being able to brag on social media and to everyone in sight (especially liberals) that Trump got his great tax cuts plan through Congress, and isn't he the greatest prez ever. They'll get to gloat and trash talk and taunt all the liberals they know (or at least the ones they interact with on social media), and revel in librul complaints and "whining" about the bill. The actual effect of the bill, or what's in it, doesn't really matter to them. What matters is pissing off liberals. If it does that, it must be good. So, there's no doubt many of them will be happy and thrilled when/if this passes Congress, and Trump throws a huge celebration at the WH to sign it into law and gloat (you know it's coming).
 
To be fair, the main joy that Trump supporters will get from this being passed has almost nothing to do with the meager (if any) tax breaks they'll get from it. Instead, it will come from being able to brag on social media and to everyone in sight (especially liberals) that Trump got his great tax cuts plan through Congress, and isn't he the greatest prez ever. They'll get to gloat and trash talk and taunt all the liberals they know (or at least the ones they interact with on social media), and revel in librul complaints and "whining" about the bill. The actual effect of the bill, or what's in it, doesn't really matter to them. What matters is pissing off liberals. If it does that, it must be good. So, there's no doubt many of them will be happy and thrilled when/if this passes Congress, and Trump throws a huge celebration at the WH to sign it into law and gloat (you know it's coming).

Fucking idiot CNN had a graphic on earlier today saying it was going to be an "historic victory" on tax cuts...historic? Really?
 
To be fair, the main joy that Trump supporters will get from this being passed has almost nothing to do with the meager (if any) tax breaks they'll get from it. Instead, it will come from being able to brag on social media and to everyone in sight (especially liberals) that Trump got his great tax cuts plan through Congress, and isn't he the greatest prez ever. They'll get to gloat and trash talk and taunt all the liberals they know (or at least the ones they interact with on social media), and revel in librul complaints and "whining" about the bill. The actual effect of the bill, or what's in it, doesn't really matter to them. What matters is pissing off liberals. If it does that, it must be good. So, there's no doubt many of them will be happy and thrilled when/if this passes Congress, and Trump throws a huge celebration at the WH to sign it into law and gloat (you know it's coming).

Cept its not gonna piss off liberals. It'll make them happy once they look at their paychecks and stop listening to all that liberal #fakenews.

JCT came out with revised numbers backing out the ACA adjustment a few days ago. By 2025, a whopping 10.7% had their taxes go up.

I suppose liberals will get mad when they realize that once again they're out of touch with the American people and just ushered in 4 more years, but I don't think that's what you were going for.
 
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Cept its not gonna piss off liberals. It'll make them happy once they look at their paychecks and stop listening to all that liberal #fakenews.

JCT came out with revised numbers backing out the ACA adjustment. By 2025, a whopping 10.7% had their taxes go up.

So 32 million people?
 
Cept its not gonna piss off liberals. It'll make them happy once they look at their paychecks and stop listening to all that liberal #fakenews.

JCT came out with revised numbers backing out the ACA adjustment. By 2025, a whopping 10.7% had their taxes go up.

LOL. You're already gloating and it hasn't even been passed yet. Getting a jump on the competition!
 
palma has so much in common with 2&2. They have achieved a certain level of educational and professional success (although 2&2 is light-years more accomplished than palma), so you know there is some intellectual horsepower in there somewhere. On the other hand, their posts show them to be absolute morons, incapable of complex thoughts. Quite the conundrum.
 
Dynamic score from the JCT is out. Shocker, it doesn't pay for itself.
 
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