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Biggest Reform EVER passed thread

tiltdeac said:
Is it really that easy for rich people to just declare themselves corporations?

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-f...shelter-for-wealthy-americans-c-corporations/
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I find it hard to believe its terribly beneficial going from being taxed once to being taxed twice

warak said:
if stocks keep falling (-120 after an hour) after teh Flynn information, what will happen to the tax bill that only 28% of American agree with?
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I'd love to see the wording of this "poll" which has 28% of americans approving of a bill that saves money for 90% of americans next year.
 
Every day of trumps presidency must slowly kill him. Wants to be happy and gloat for tax reform passing, happens to fall the same day the russia investigation greatly intensifies. If he wasn’t such a piece of shit you might have sympathy for him.
 
palmab03 said:
I find it hard to believe its terribly beneficial going from being taxed once to being taxed twice.
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Why would it be taxed twice?

For years, the intricacies of the tax code have encouraged businesses to shun the traditional corporate form of business—the C-corporation—and instead to organize as what are known as “pass-throughs,” taxed not at the corporate rate but at the individual income tax rate. The incentive to structure a business as a pass-through is so strong that in 2014, 95 percent of America’s 26 million businesses were organized that way.

The pending reduction in the corporate tax rate from a maximum of 35 percent to 20 percent will flip the equation for many taxpayers, giving business owners and some wage earners a way to shelter their income and avoid paying taxes at the higher individual tax rates of up to 42.3 percent by becoming C-corporations. Because the Senate tax bill includes no rules to limit the ability of professionals—like managers, lawyers, or doctors—to incorporate and have their labor income treated as corporate profits, a non-corporate business may elect to be taxed at the corporate rate. And that election will be simple, requiring checking a box on a form, no lawyers required, no elaborate paperwork needed. This tax sheltering will not only cost the Treasury a substantial amount of money, it will benefit the highest-income and most financially sophisticated Americans in ways that do nothing to help the overall economy or create jobs.
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Louis Gossett Jr said:
Every day of trumps presidency must slowly kill him. Wants to be happy and gloat for tax reform passing, happens to fall the same day the russia investigation greatly intensifies. If he wasn’t such a piece of shit you might have sympathy for him.
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We all have to lie in the bed we make
 
palmab03 said:
I find it hard to believe its terribly beneficial going from being taxed once to being taxed twice



I'd love to see the wording of this "poll" which has 28% of americans approving of a bill that saves money for 90% of americans next year.
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sorry 32%

The GOP’s tax bill is historically unpopular
APPROVE
YEAR POLLSTER TAX BILL YES NO DIFF.
1981 Gallup Reagan tax cut I 51% 26% +25
2001 Harris W. Bush tax cut I 49 37 +12
2010 ABC/WaPo Extending Bush tax cuts I 54 42 +12
2013 ABC/WaPo Extending Bush tax cuts II 45 38 +7
2003 Harris W. Bush tax cut II 45 39 +6
1986 CBS/NYT Reagan tax cut II 38 34 +4
1993 Gallup Clinton tax hike 34 44 -10
1990 Voter News Service H.W. Bush tax hike 41 52 -11
2017 November average* Trump tax cut 32 46 -14
*Average of surveys by CNN, Quinnipiac University, Morning Consult, ABC/WaPo and YouGov.
Note: The polls included in this table used different question wording, including variations on “support,” “approve” and “favor,” as well as “oppose” “disapprove” and “vote down.”

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-gop-tax-cuts-are-even-more-unpopular-than-past-tax-hikes/
 
tiltdeac said:
Why would it be taxed twice?
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When you own a stock of a C-Corp, the Corporation pays a 20% tax rate when it's earned, and then you also pay taxes when they distribute the income to you.

You can't take the money cash free, although you can do tricky things like adjust the timing, give yourself loans, etc.
 
warak said:
sorry 32%

The GOP’s tax bill is historically unpopular
APPROVE
YEAR POLLSTER TAX BILL YES NO DIFF.
1981 Gallup Reagan tax cut I 51% 26% +25
2001 Harris W. Bush tax cut I 49 37 +12
2010 ABC/WaPo Extending Bush tax cuts I 54 42 +12
2013 ABC/WaPo Extending Bush tax cuts II 45 38 +7
2003 Harris W. Bush tax cut II 45 39 +6
1986 CBS/NYT Reagan tax cut II 38 34 +4
1993 Gallup Clinton tax hike 34 44 -10
1990 Voter News Service H.W. Bush tax hike 41 52 -11
2017 November average* Trump tax cut 32 46 -14
*Average of surveys by CNN, Quinnipiac University, Morning Consult, ABC/WaPo and YouGov.
Note: The polls included in this table used different question wording, including variations on “support,” “approve” and “favor,” as well as “oppose” “disapprove” and “vote down.”

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-gop-tax-cuts-are-even-more-unpopular-than-past-tax-hikes/
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lol. morans

"Only 16 percent of American voters say the Republican tax plan will reduce their taxes, while 35 percent of voters say it will increase their taxes and 36 percent say it won't have much impact on their taxes. "
 
palmab03 said:
When you own a stock of a C-Corp, the Corporation pays a 20% tax rate when it's earned, and then you also pay taxes when they distribute the income to you.

You can't take the money cash free, although you can do tricky things like adjust the timing, give yourself loans, etc.
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which is why you make yourself an S Corp and pass the income through that entity vs collecting a wage. everyone is a consultant
 
chart1-lisa.png
 
ImTheCaptain said:
which is why you make yourself an S Corp and pass the income through that entity vs collecting a wage. everyone is a consultant
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Well that's what I'd do, but they make that option not terribly viable for accountants/lawyers/etc. Although small (1.5%), there are also S-corp taxes. For the most part you can't justify having a wage below the SS cap of $127k, so the wage vs pass through benefit isn't that huge under the new tax rates. I mean I could maybe save a few thousand dollars if I got to the $400k income level, but the legal/accounting costs probably eat all that up.
 
palmab03 said:
When you own a stock of a C-Corp, the Corporation pays a 20% tax rate when it's earned, and then you also pay taxes when they distribute the income to you.

You can't take the money cash free, although you can do tricky things like adjust the timing, give yourself loans, etc.
Click to expand...

I see what you mean, but it seems like there are ways around that that will allow a lot of rich people to decrease their effective rates even more.

C-corporation shareholders would pay the 20 percent corporate tax, but also pay dividend or capital gains taxes on their individual tax returns at rates up to 23.8 percent. In practice, however, the effective rate on capital gains tends to be much lower than the statutory rate because shareholders can defer selling shares and because several provisions eliminate the tax entirely. In addition to the lower rate, C corporate form would allow many taxpayers the ability to deduct fringe benefits many pass-through business owners are currently unable to deduct, like health insurance premiums and fringe benefits, and to use itemized deductions, like state and local taxes paid, which would no longer be deductible for individuals. This favorable tax treatment will give some highly-paid wage earners or pass-through business owners strong incentives to turn their wages and pass-through income into corporate profits.
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palmab03 said:
Well that's what I'd do, but they make that option not terribly viable for accountants/lawyers/etc. Although small (1.5%), there are also S-corp taxes. For the most part you can't justify having a wage below the SS cap of $127k, so the wage vs pass through benefit isn't that huge under the new tax rates. I mean I could maybe save a few thousand dollars if I got to the $400k income level, but the legal/accounting costs probably eat all that up.
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a few thousand? you just said Americans would get a boner over $12-24,000
 
ImTheCaptain said:
a few thousand? you just said Americans would get a boner over $12-24,000
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Well the Senate plan doesn't reduce the "pass-through" rate, what it does is allow you to deduct 17% of pass through income. Doesn't have a huge effect if no one is itemizing due to the higher standard deduction and no SALT taxes. If what tilt posted about the SALT taxes being back in play is true, then its easier to game the system.

But if SALT taxes were non-deductible, then you essentially need business income in excess of wages to be greater than like $150k for it to get over your standard deduction. Not everyone can just quit their job and be a consultant and make $250k.

But then take it a step further, say they make $400k. That's $150k business income over the standard deduction *.17*.24 = $6k in savings on $400k in income by "becoming a consultant" Probably not worth the hassle. I'm not quitting a job someone is paying me $400k for to go start my own business and take on the risk for $6k.
 
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