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Boy Scouts will admit girls

"Are you one of those people who thinks that women have a more-than-adequate shake when it comes to careers and leadership opportunities." Again, what are you talking about? You keep attributing things to me that I have not said and do not believe. Stop it.

Why does "teaching inner strength and integrity, training future leaders" absolutely require the presence of the opposite sex in every instance, 24/7/365, no matter what, or else we cannot "train our kids to be better people"? Seriously? What does anything you just said have to do with this issue?

There is absolutely no shortage of exposure to the opposite sex for boys and girls in 21st Century American society. Boys and girls grow up in co-ed households, go to school co-ed, play sports in many instances co-ed, belong to other co-ed clubs and organizations, go to church co-ed, and on, on and on. I strongly believe that there is still a place for single-sex organizations/environments, and they can and do provide a positive experience in ways that a co-ed environment cannot, just as co-ed environments can provide positive experiences in ways that a single-sex environment/organization cannot.

Moreover, what does that have to do with whether or not single-sex organization for youth can be a positive thing?

i actually disagree that there are numerous opportunities like the one that scouting offers for small groups to bond and grow together. sports are segregated extremely early. Beyond sports, girls are clearly taught that their version of any activity is inherently inferior, almost without exception. Just look at the language here, we're cordoning boys off because girls are a distraction? You are teaching the boys girls are a distraction by default.

we're still all breathless in anticipation for the example where the presence of a female prevented a male from learning how to fish and/or control his impulses.
 
i actually disagree that there are numerous opportunities like the one that scouting offers for small groups to bond and grow together. sports are segregated extremely early. Beyond sports, girls are clearly taught that their version of any activity is inherently inferior, almost without exception. Just look at the language here, we're cordoning boys off because girls are a distraction? You are teaching the boys girls are a distraction by default.

we're still all breathless in anticipation for the example where the presence of a female prevented a male from learning how to fish and/or control his impulses.

I've given specific examples that have yet to be addressed by you or Numbers. Kindly eat a dick, friend.
 
I addressed it. I don't think "we rough house together" is a good reason to separate the sexes in a civic organization.
 
Star Scout here, I never "roughhoused."

Could have gone Eagle, but I quit the troop because all the other boys were shitheads and didn't pull their weight. If a girl is motivated enough to join the Boy Scouts then I'm all for it.
 
The fact that boys are idiots at 14 is not a sufficient reason by itself to exclude girls, particularly when there is not an active Girl Scout program available to them.
 
Star Scout here, I never "roughhoused."

Could have gone Eagle, but I quit the troop because all the other boys were shitheads and didn't pull their weight. If a girl is motivated enough to join the Boy Scouts then I'm all for it.

Why didn't you just beat the shit out of them until they became model citizens?
 
I've given specific examples that have yet to be addressed by you or Numbers. Kindly eat a dick, friend.

i mean, your examples were "we knew a boy who was a dick, then went to scouts and is now not a dick"

that's awesome but how does that prove that girls would prevent that from happening..? it doesn't.

again, if we stop telling boys that girls are a problem, they won't be a problem. if the US military can figure out it, i'm pretty sure we can work with some kids.
 
The underlying theory of course to all these posts is that there is a benefit for being (and becoming) a “man” instead of a “woman” and that there is inherent value to this distinction.

I don’t think this distinction serves much.

We aren't talking about the benefit of becoming a woman because we are talking about the boy scouts and what it offers uniquely to boys. We raise boys and girls differently in this culture and every culture. Nobody is saying we need to go back to the 1820s and raise them all to be housewives. That doesn't mean that men and women are physically alike and should be handled the same way. There is more inherent value in making that distinction than in pretending to live in a world where such a distinction doesn't or shouldn't exist.
 
no one suggested they were. I countered with the US military. seems like teenage kids are probably not going to be equal, boys or girls. It might come to no surprise that I was not winning Presidential Fitness Medals in middle & high school while my wife was a star on the soccer field and tennis court.
 
We aren't talking about the benefit of becoming a woman because we are talking about the boy scouts and what it offers uniquely to boys. We raise boys and girls differently in this culture and every culture. Nobody is saying we need to go back to the 1820s and raise them all to be housewives. That doesn't mean that men and women are physically alike and should be handled the same way. There is more inherent value in making that distinction than in pretending to live in a world where such a distinction doesn't or shouldn't exist.

I'm not saying we don't raise boys and girls differently, I'm arguing that we should not do so. I keep asking for reasons why we should raise them differently other than "that's just how we do it."

The answers provided so far are:

1. Boys rough house and whip each other into model citizens
2. Girls are distractions to boys
3. Boys and girls are physically different and girls can't hack it in top-tier professional sports (and this is supposedly relevant to the Boy Scouts)

Any other reasons on this list?
 
Did any of you asshats read the article?
Starting next year, young girls can join Cub Scout units, known as dens. Local scouting organizations can choose to have dens for girls and dens for boys. "Cub Scout dens will be single-gender — all boys or all girls," the organization said in a statement.

A separate program for older girls will be available in 2019, the Boy Scouts said, enabling them to earn the rank of Eagle Scout.


SEPARATE programs for boys and girls, so you can still have your beloved same-sex groups doing all the things and rough-housing and whatever.
This just allows for girls to participate in the PROGRAM of boy scouts, which is definitely different from Girl Scouts.
As as Girl Scout Gold Award recipient and the sister of two Eagle Scouts, I can say for certain our programs were quite different from one-another, and had I not been in a really, really good Girl Scout troop with an incredible leader I absolutely would have been interested in doing Venture scouts (or one of the other BSA programs that allowed girls at the time). The camping and outdoors activities seemed more fun to me, the merit badges were more interesting than our interest project patches, and the overall civic mindset was more appealing to me than Girl Scouts as a whole. Allowing for girls to participate in that kind of a program - that's already established and vetted as a positive program - can only be positive.
 
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We aren't talking about the benefit of becoming a woman because we are talking about the boy scouts and what it offers uniquely to boys. We raise boys and girls differently in this culture and every culture. Nobody is saying we need to go back to the 1820s and raise them all to be housewives. That doesn't mean that men and women are physically alike and should be handled the same way. There is more inherent value in making that distinction than in pretending to live in a world where such a distinction doesn't or shouldn't exist.

What the deuce does physical anything have to do with this discussion? It's scouting. Not wrestling. Pretty sure you can learn how to be a civic leader and member of your community regardless of whether you've got an innie or an outie.
 
in addition to the, unanswered in any meaningful way, question above i'd like to know what scout activities healthy and active girls could not manage? camping? hiking? jogging? canoeing? adolescent girls often have similar physical profiles. hit their teens and the physical differences start kicking in so they can't run any more? sure maybe they are not as fast on average but does not mean they can't do the activities.

i for one am tired of having to have conversations with my daughter about why she hears and is told misogynistic things about what she can and can't do, like etc. have you tried buying girls cloths? pink. purple. check. blue? not easy. red. can be tough. uggs? yep and f that. yoga pants for 6 and 7 year olds? you got it. daisy dukes? anywhere you go.

maybe treating girls and boys a little more alike would end some of the misogyny, glass ceiling bs, bullying, assault, stereotyping that plagues our society and gives us people like mike pence who can't trust himself to be alone with a woman.

the boy scouts may be late to the party. they may be doing it for the wrong reason (enrollment). but maybe it starts doing some good for raising our boys and girls in this country that has, for too long, been an old white guy party. no one else is allowed without their permission because they don't want to lose their power and privilege.
 
in addition to the, unanswered in any meaningful way, question above i'd like to know what scout activities healthy and active girls could not manage? camping? hiking? jogging? canoeing? adolescent girls often have similar physical profiles. hit their teens and the physical differences start kicking in so they can't run any more? sure maybe they are not as fast on average but does not mean they can't do the activities.

i for one am tired of having to have conversations with my daughter about why she hears and is told misogynistic things about what she can and can't do, like etc. have you tried buying girls cloths? pink. purple. check. blue? not easy. red. can be tough. uggs? yep and f that. yoga pants for 6 and 7 year olds? you got it. daisy dukes? anywhere you go.

maybe treating girls and boys a little more alike would end some of the misogyny, glass ceiling bs, bullying, assault, stereotyping that plagues our society and gives us people like mike pence who can't trust himself to be alone with a woman.

the boy scouts may be late to the party. they may be doing it for the wrong reason (enrollment). but maybe it starts doing some good for raising our boys and girls in this country that has, for too long, been an old white guy party. no one else is allowed without their permission because they don't want to lose their power and privilege.

good post. but we need to make sure Boys have a chance to grow into Men, and we can't let girls interfere
 
What the deuce does physical anything have to do with this discussion? It's scouting. Not wrestling. Pretty sure you can learn how to be a civic leader and member of your community regardless of whether you've got an innie or an outie.

What do belly buttons have to do with anything?
 
I don't care either way about this (and haven't read through page 2) but I'lll take the under on when the push begins to remove Boy from the title and make it just Scouts.
 
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