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The demise of Wake Forest Basketball

Your original post was not exactly clear as to which of Elrod's hiring you were referring to. After Clawson let him go as a coach, Elrod was hired by IMG Sports to do color commentary. IMG is a contractor to Wake. Elrod was no longer directly employed by Wake. The circumstances were not like Bz, Rusty and Chill.

I was definitely not clear. That's why I've clarified. The circumstances are certainly not equivalent, but I've heard boards rumors, which are usually bullshit, that the athletic department pushed for Elrod to be retained as color guy (by IMG?) despite Clawson's wishes. If true, this would be an example of Wellman micromanaging (which I'm arguing against on this thread, but trying to get the facts fairly). Thoughts?

How often does the football coach decide who the radio color guy is?

I have absolutely no idea. How often does an athletic director decide?
 
Clawson said himself that he questioned hiring a radio guy that he had not retained as coach but everybody in the athletic department vouched for Elrod. It was in a video of an interview Clawson did about the whole affair.

Now it’s possible Clawson was overstating his objection to the hire but I see no reason not to trust him.
 
Clawson said himself that he questioned hiring a radio guy that he had not retained as coach but everybody in the athletic department vouched for Elrod. It was in a video of an interview Clawson did about the whole affair.

Now it’s possible Clawson was overstating his objection to the hire but I see no reason not to trust him.
You're still skirting my question here: who, exactly, pushed for his hiring as radio announcer?

I'm pretty much arguing a point that runs against my general opinion about how I think Wellman runs the AD. Elrod's hiring as color guy, if pushed by upper administration in the AD, would be evidence that Wellman has interfered in football stuff. Look how that turned out.

Anyways, whatever, if the Wellman-haters don't want to follow this thread (or it's a dumb question) I'll leave it alone.
 
I don't think the AD is "interfering" when involved in the process of hiring someone outside the hierarchy of the football coach unless you have plenty of examples of football coaches hiring radio personnel.
 
I don't think the AD is "interfering" when involved in the process of hiring someone outside the hierarchy of the football coach unless you have plenty of examples of football coaches hiring radio personnel.

I don't have any examples, that's why I've asked here. But to be quite honest, before the Elrod scandal I had no idea that radio personnel, at least at Wake Forest, were as deeply integrated into the everyday activities of the program.
 
My Dad was the color man for Wake sports with Gene Overby for years. I can tell you he had little to no information about the daily activities of any sports. He heard rumors and a little recruiting speculation.But never anything major.
 
My Dad was the color man for Wake sports with Gene Overby for years. I can tell you he had little to no information about the daily activities of any sports. He heard rumors and a little recruiting speculation.But never anything major.

How is Glenn Scott doing these days? Always like him on WSJS.
 
I think you're right that Wellman's behavior and BSing during the [Redacted] years should probably be considered patronizing and uncool, but like I said I feel like protecting the coach from criticism is the athletic director's job. If [Redacted] hadn't have been such a shitty coach (and, perhaps much more importantly, a shitty communicator) we probably wouldn't have seen so much bullshit propaganda from the Department. The fact that DM has authority and cachet and a reputation has meant that the AD can largely stay out of it.



This is a much stronger argument, and it *does* seem like Wellman did try to manage the basketball program's recruiting strategy during the Dino times. It didn't work primarily because the landscape of college basketball changed a lot in the subsequent years. And it is a fact that DM is recruiting one-and-done high school players meaning one of the following things is true: that either Wellman has let DM dictate his own recruiting strategies (i.e. *not* micromanaging); or Wellman has changed his opinion on one-and-done players for whatever reason (i.e. not stubborn/arrogant in the way he's often accused). There could be other possibilities, of course, but these are the two most obvious.

The assistant coaches thing is another fair point I'd forgotten about. Is there evidence he did this elsewhere? Wouldn't Elrod be an example of the same practice as Rusty and Childress?


So from a recruiting strategy standpoint, are we confident that the administration is now accepting of the fact that we recruit one and done type players? If so, it would seem that Wellman/Adminstration was woefully behind the curve when the CBB landscape started to change and now we are playing catchup (unsuccessfully at that). Perhaps the fact that a certain school down the road with a high academic profile started chasing one and dones changed the tune of the Administration?
 
What evidence is there of Wellman micromanaging any of our basketball coaches? Or the coaches of any other wake sport for that matter?

Cliff Notes:

1) Rusty LaRue
2) Randolph Childress
3) Culture Club
4) Wellman taking interviews rather than [name redacted]

It's absurd to look back over the last 8 years and suggest that Wellman hasn't tried to micromange the Wake basketball team into his own little slice of what he thinks basketball culture should be.
 
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Cliff Notes:

1) Rusty LaRue
2) Randolph Childress
3) Culture Club
4) Wellman taking interviews rather than [name redacted]
5) Changed radio format so callers can no longer ask questions on air
6) Publicly stated in the WSJ that "Wake will not be preached to" (paraphrased)

It's absurd to look back over the last 8 years and suggest that Wellman hasn't tried to micromange the Wake basketball team into his own little slice of what he thinks basketball culture should be.
 
So from a recruiting strategy standpoint, are we confident that the administration is now accepting of the fact that we recruit one and done type players? If so, it would seem that Wellman/Adminstration was woefully behind the curve when the CBB landscape started to change and now we are playing catchup (unsuccessfully at that). Perhaps the fact that a certain school down the road with a high academic profile started chasing one and dones changed the tune of the Administration?


DING! DING! DING! We have a winner!
 
Cliff Notes:

1) Rusty LaRue
2) Randolph Childress
3) Culture Club
4) Wellman taking interviews rather than [name redacted]

It's absurd to look back over the last 8 years and suggest that Wellman hasn't tried to micromange the Wake basketball team into his own little slice of what he thinks basketball culture should be.

I mentioned most of these above. As for the others, changing the radio format and taking interviews for [Redacted] are *not* examples of micromanaging. Micromanaging implies it is done against the will of the person being managed. It's more like just managing. Which is what I said above.

It's kinda frustrating to write these long, thoughtful posts and have people respond to a single line by repeating what I've already said.
 
So from a recruiting strategy standpoint, are we confident that the administration is now accepting of the fact that we recruit one and done type players? If so, it would seem that Wellman/Adminstration was woefully behind the curve when the CBB landscape started to change and now we are playing catchup (unsuccessfully at that). Perhaps the fact that a certain school down the road with a high academic profile started chasing one and dones changed the tune of the Administration?

Thanks for responding to the substance of my post.

I don't know the answer to this question, and that's why I posed it to the boards. But I suspect you're right on the money here in regards to Wellman (perhaps begrudgingly) changing his mind based on the fact that duke found success (and no academic penalties to speak of) with this strategy.
 
I mentioned most of these above. As for the others, changing the radio format and taking interviews for [name redacted] are *not* examples of micromanaging. Micromanaging implies it is done against the will of the person being managed. It's more like just managing. Which is what I said above.

There is zero implication in the term "micromanaging" that it is being done against the will of the person being managed. Micromanaging just indicates that someone is involved in small details that they shouldn't otherwise be concerning themselves with if they had hired a competent person to perform the job, or if they didn't want to impose their own will onto the way even the smallest of tasks are completed.

It's kinda frustrating to write these long, thoughtful posts and have people respond to a single line by repeating what I've already said.

Paragraphs upon paragraphs have been written on these topics. Nothing left to do but summarize the obvious.
 
I mentioned most of these above. As for the others, changing the radio format and taking interviews for [Redacted] are *not* examples of micromanaging. Micromanaging implies it is done against the will of the person being managed. It's more like just managing. Which is what I said above.

It's kinda frustrating to write these long, thoughtful posts and have people respond to a single line by repeating what I've already said.

I mean, he did say "Cliff Notes:" right at the very beginning of the post, which means what follows is a summary of the original work. Though I am sure you'd like me to point out that it should be "CliffsNotes".
 
So from a recruiting strategy standpoint, are we confident that the administration is now accepting of the fact that we recruit one and done type players? If so, it would seem that Wellman/Adminstration was woefully behind the curve when the CBB landscape started to change and now we are playing catchup (unsuccessfully at that). Perhaps the fact that a certain school down the road with a high academic profile started chasing one and dones changed the tune of the Administration?

I don't know that it's about being entirely behind the curve of CBB. Wellman wanted us to be Villanova. But we sure don't have Jay Wright.
 
I don't know that it's about being entirely behind the curve of CBB. Wellman wanted us to be Villanova. But we sure don't have Jay Wright.

We should have tried to hire Jay Wright a few years ago when the Big East was collapsing.
 
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