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Jordan Brand Classic - 5PM EST on ESPN2, Jaylen Hoard playing

If Hoard is not great from day 1 you can all kiss my ass for all these comments above.
 
Yeah, seriously. Let's slow down on the comparisons until he actually plays in a college game, rather than glorified pickup ball.
 
Hoard has a ceiling as high as anyone that has come to Wake. But even though a player has NBA all-star potential down the line, that does not mean they will play like an NBA all-star from day 1.
 
Ayo said:
Yeah, seriously. Let's slow down on the comparisons until he actually plays in a college game, rather than glorified pickup ball.
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Even in these "glorified pickup ball" games, you can get a sense of his style of play, and who he plays "like." It would not be a good comparison to say he plays "like" Big E, for instance.
 
netflixnchildres said:
Hoard has a ceiling as high as anyone that has come to Wake. But even though a player has NBA all-star potential down the line, that does not mean they will play like an NBA all-star from day 1.
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He has a ceiling as high as Duncan and CP3? C'mon, man.
 
Deaconblue said:
Even in these "glorified pickup ball" games, you can get a sense of his style of play, and who he plays "like." It would not be a good comparison to say he plays "like" Big E, for instance.
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Yeah. He doesn’t play like freshman Howard because Howard didn’t have his full complement of skills yet. He was a raw scorer with no outside shot and limited ball handling. Hoard has the skills Howard developed by his senior year. Will he be as good? Probably not. But he has that kind of skill set.
 
Ayo said:
He has a ceiling as high as Duncan and CP3? C'mon, man.
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They play different positions, and I'm not saying Hoard is destined to be an all-time great, just that he has the tools to. As far as Wake Forest forwards go, Hoard could be as good or better than AFA and Howard down the line, I just don't expect it to be instant. Not many players come in and are instant stars. Duncan wasn't a superstar as a freshman, but he definitely became one at Wake. If Hoard sticks around for sophomore year and develops, he could put up big numbers here and go on to have a good NBA career. We should be excited for him, but also don't need to expect him to average 20, 7, and 3 from the start.
 
PhDeac said:
Yeah. He doesn’t play like freshman Howard because Howard didn’t have his full complement of skills yet. He was a raw scorer with no outside shot and limited ball handling. Hoard has the skills Howard developed by his senior year. Will he be as good? Probably not. But he has that kind of skill set.
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Howard was very raw as a freshman. I remember watching him during the midnight madness and liking his defensive skill set, but his offense was raw. His shot was flat and very mechanical (mainly due to the length of his arms). JHo put in a LOT of hours at Wake to develop a competent jump shot. Hoard is far more advanced that JHo at the same age (they will both be older freshman...both entered/will enter college as 19 year olds.) If we can get Hoard for 4 years somehow I have no doubt that he would develop into an All-American team type player. I really don't think we get that chance.
 
Wrangor said:
Howard was very raw as a freshman. I remember watching him during the midnight madness and liking his defensive skill set, but his offense was raw. His shot was flat and very mechanical (mainly due to the length of his arms). JHo put in a LOT of hours at Wake to develop a competent jump shot. Hoard is far more advanced that JHo at the same age (they will both be older freshman...both entered/will enter college as 19 year olds.) If we can get Hoard for 4 years somehow I have no doubt that he would develop into an All-American team type player. I really don't think we get that chance.
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Josh was the most complete player at Wake in 20 yearts IMO
 
sportsnut said:
Josh was the most complete player at Wake in 20 yearts IMO
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Agree. But he came in defensively ready to compete, and put in the work to get the offense ready. He did the work, and had the natural ability to build a great set of offensive fundamentals.
 
The Nike game was very close until Hoard’s all around play helped them pull away. Jaylen played “winning” fundamentally sound basketball. Unfortunately, our team didn’t do that very consistently this past season. To be successful next season we have got to get a lot smarter across the board in how we play.
 
Things that stuck out to me watching Hoard:

1. He can grab the defensive rebound and start the break himself.
2. He looked comfortable guarding wings on the perimeter
3. When Team USA went zone, he set up on high post and made them pay for it
4. He was a surprisingly good passer---on perimeter, on break, and in the interior

Can see him averaging 13.5 and 6.5, but making us SO much better than last year.

If Crawford and Moore return AND we add Dixon, we will have so many different mixes of players that would work. Can go "small" with Crawford, Dixon, Brown, Hoard, Moore. Can go "big" with Crawford, Brown, Hoard, Sarr, Moore. Have Chill and Mucius and (Melo, Wright, etc) crew to through in there. There is no excuse to not be a good defensive team. No excuse not to make NCAA. Even Manning cant screw up rotations.

Here are two extremes of what could happen next year:

Best case: Crawford and Moore return. Dixon comes. We truly have a very good year and start out really strong. The return of swagger is enough that we are able to salvage a reasonable 2019 class. At least 2 of Hoard/Brown/Sarr return for 2019. The foundation is then potentially set for an NCAA team each year.

Worst case: Crawford and Moore leave. Hoard/Brown/Sarr have reasonable years, but we are on outside looking in at NCAA and never very good. 2019 ends up being a very mediocre class. Hoard goes 1 and done. One of Brown/Sarr leaves to player professionally or transfers. Manning is fired. New coach has a pretty bare cupboard and is not the savior everyone wants. Rebuild starts from scratch.
 
Good post. The worst case scenario is why it makes sense to fire Manning now.
 
Don't forget the middle of the road case. the combo of talent is enough to overcome strange line ups and a few of the normal late game collapses (not all) and we land right on the bubble with a first round loss. That will be more than enough for ronnie to pat himself on the back declare his brilliance.
 
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