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NCAA Golf Regionals/Womens Championship

Bubble Boy said:
It's not like we had 5 freshman playing in their first tourney. If some of these guys don't get how to manage their score at this point in their career, then it sounds like they aren't getting very good coaching.
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These players know how to swing the club and manage their games before they get to college. We just don’t have depth because the tuition and academic grind keeps us from getting walk ons and players willing to accept partial scholarships. WFU used to give out 8 or more full rides before the NCAA cut it back to 4.5. We have quality players in the top 2 or 3 spots. The rest of the team is very mediocre.
 
wfu22fan said:
These players know how to swing the club and manage their games before they get to college. We just don’t have depth because the tuition and academic grind keeps us from getting walk ons and players willing to accept partial scholarships. WFU used to give out 8 or more full rides before the NCAA cut it back to 4.5. We have quality players in the top 2 or 3 spots. The rest of the team is very mediocre.
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That was my recollection as well. Wake was one of the few schools to use all the available golf scholarships because they were fully funded (Thanks Arnie!) back when that didn't happen a lot. Wake has not fared well with the limited scholarships currently allowed by the NCAA. Also Wake hasn't always been elite school expensive. Wake used to be pretty financially competitive with a lot of state schools particularly their out of state rates.

I wonder how state institutions charge out of state students who are on partial athletic scholarships. Do they charge the student half out of state tuition etc., but charge the scholarship at in-state rates (see u*NC practice, for example) or does the student get his half at in-state rates because he is a student athlete and they get in state rates for scholarship?
 
I would really like to hear the argument why Haas should remain coach at this point.
 
It's just not accurate to say that WF #4 and #5 players are not quality recruits.

WF's #4 was Eric Bae; he was NC State Champion as HS junior and runner-up senior; Bae qualified for match play in the US Junior Am (top 64 junior players in the US and the world) and advanced twice; everyone in the ACC wanted him. WF #5 Lee Detmer is the #519 amateur player in the world and was recruited by multiple ACC schools out of HS (he just happened to post his three worst rounds of the year in the NCAAs). WF's #6 (alternate in Columbus) Marco Steyn was the top ranked amateur in South Africa when he was recruited to WF and was #225 in the World Amateur rankings. All three, particularly Bae and Steyn, were big time recruits when they signed for WF.

WF is not fielding a team with walk-ons in the #4 and #5 spots because of the scholarship limits. These are big time amateur players that have as good, if not better, resumes than the #4 and #5 spots on teams that are kicking WF's butt.
 
I agree with Pilchard in that we get at a minimum talent that should consistently keep us in the top 20. Ig you look back over the past 10 years you'll see good to great regular seasons and consistently poor performance in the ACC and NCAA Regional. Losing Will might have cost us the ACC title but even Will couldn't have gotten us to a top 5 finish in the Regional. As good as Bill Haas was his senior year (Fred Haskins award) even he couldn't carry the team out of the Regional.

The cost of going to Wake and number of scholarships have nothing to do with our struggles...Northwestern and Duke are better than us and going to the finals. Wake has committed a ton of money to being a consistently elite golf program but we're not seeing the results. Cameron Young came to Wake as a top 5 recruit and he's regressed each year. College golf is all about your conference tournament and making the NCAA finals.
 
Shake said:
I agree with Pilchard in that we get at a minimum talent that should consistently keep us in the top 20. Ig you look back over the past 10 years you'll see good to great regular seasons and consistently poor performance in the ACC and NCAA Regional. Losing Will might have cost us the ACC title but even Will couldn't have gotten us to a top 5 finish in the Regional. As good as Bill Haas was his senior year (Fred Haskins award) even he couldn't carry the team out of the Regional.

The cost of going to Wake and number of scholarships have nothing to do with our struggles...Northwestern and Duke are better than us and going to the finals. Wake has committed a ton of money to being a consistently elite golf program but we're not seeing the results. Cameron Young came to Wake as a top 5 recruit and he's regressed each year. College golf is all about your conference tournament and making the NCAA finals.
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this shouldn't matter, as the depth should have been there anyway; however...

it would have been close, but take Detmer off the roster and replace him with Zalatoris, and WF probably finishes top 5 (barely)

Detmer had the drop score all three rounds, forcing WF to count scores of 76-78-78

if Zalatoris shoots 71-71-71 to finish at even par (which would tie for 9th place), that's an improvement of 19 strokes, putting WF into a tie for 4th with NW, two strokes ahead of Texas Tech

now one could argue we shouldn't have had, as a team, 9 rounds of +4 or worse, and I would agree with that all day long
 
Pilchard said:
It's just not accurate to say that WF #4 and #5 players are not quality recruits.

WF's #4 was Eric Bae; he was NC State Champion as HS junior and runner-up senior; Bae qualified for match play in the US Junior Am (top 64 junior players in the US and the world) and advanced twice; everyone in the ACC wanted him. WF #5 Lee Detmer is the #519 amateur player in the world and was recruited by multiple ACC schools out of HS (he just happened to post his three worst rounds of the year in the NCAAs). WF's #6 (alternate in Columbus) Marco Steyn was the top ranked amateur in South Africa when he was recruited to WF and was #225 in the World Amateur rankings. All three, particularly Bae and Steyn, were big time recruits when they signed for WF.

WF is not fielding a team with walk-ons in the #4 and #5 spots because of the scholarship limits. These are big time amateur players that have as good, if not better, resumes than the #4 and #5 spots on teams that are kicking WF's butt.
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Bae also won the NC Amateur Match Play last summer.
 
Basically, Bae and Detmer just had terrible outings at the worst possible time. As a coach, how do you prevent that? I really don't know.
Detmer finished the ACC tourney 69-72 and Bae never shot higher than 74 there, finishing with a -2 70....

It seems like bad luck or bad timing but when it happens every year...? They used to say that Jesse H. could show up to follow a player and he would immediately start making birdies. People said he had the players hypnotized...
 
I also think whats lost in all of this Coach Daily has the women playing their best golf at tournament time and doing well with 2 rock stars and others who struggle to break 80. I'm amazed they qualified for the nationals but a huge congrats to them!
 
The way Zalatoris is putting right now, I don't think Wake would have made the finals if he had stayed.
 
The combination of pressure and the demand for precision makes tournament golf the most difficult sport in the world, IMO.
 
I really don't know what the answer is. Haas is a great recruiter and is getting guys that all the other top teams want. We win tournaments throughout the season and finished third in the ACCT this year (only a couple shots from winning) and then just couldn't string it together at regionals.

I think it's largely just [un]luck of the draw. You don't want to recruit worse players and there's no reason to believe that guys who have experienced individual success in other events just forget how to play in the NCAAT.
 
What is the status of Tanner Owen and kyle Sterbinsky? Seems like I heard Sterbinsky was red-shirting and perhaps Owen has been hurt for a while but not certain.
 
Yeah, what is the deal with Sterbinsky? I thought he played really well the spring of his freshman season, and he looked to be a mainstay in the top 5 for the following seasons. He rarely shot a real low round, but he also rarely blew-up, and it seemed like his score almost always counted. I would think that would make for a perfect 4/5 type of player. And then last season came around, and he basically vanished from the line-up.
 
Well, I know for a fact that Haas doesn't always base the lineup on recent/qualifying scores, "plays favorites", and can be pretty arbitrary. FWIW.
 
Failure to qualify in the regional eight of the past nine years would suggest that 'bad luck" is not the only problem.
 
Pilchard said:
It's just not accurate to say that WF #4 and #5 players are not quality recruits.

WF's #4 was Eric Bae; he was NC State Champion as HS junior and runner-up senior; Bae qualified for match play in the US Junior Am (top 64 junior players in the US and the world) and advanced twice; everyone in the ACC wanted him. WF #5 Lee Detmer is the #519 amateur player in the world and was recruited by multiple ACC schools out of HS (he just happened to post his three worst rounds of the year in the NCAAs). WF's #6 (alternate in Columbus) Marco Steyn was the top ranked amateur in South Africa when he was recruited to WF and was #225 in the World Amateur rankings. All three, particularly Bae and Steyn, were big time recruits when they signed for WF.

WF is not fielding a team with walk-ons in the #4 and #5 spots because of the scholarship limits. These are big time amateur players that have as good, if not better, resumes than the #4 and #5 spots on teams that are kicking WF's butt.
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We need 8-10 very good players. 5 won’t get it done.
 
Sounds like we have more than 5 good players. Very good, glad to know that. Now, how to judge confidence, vibes, whatever etc., and pick the 5 to play.
 
Watched part of the Oklahoma State golf profile - would definitely be curious to know how our preparation compares to theirs. I always got the impression that by the time an elite amateur has gone through the junior golf circuit and is thinking PGA Tour before stepping foot on a college campus, their training and strategy was pretty much their own and that college coaching was mainly about recruiting and letting players do their own thing. But Oklahoma State sounded pretty disciplined with a strict workout regimen and extremely detailed prep for every course and every player.

Gotta wonder after so many blowup holes if Wake could have played more conservatively, but definitely curious as to how much "coaching" really occurs in our program. Agree with the idea that we've had way too many failed postseasons to chalk it up to luck at this point...
 
Detmer had the 3rd best stroke average on the team this season in nearly 30 rounds. Just picked a hell of a bad week to have his worst three rounds of the year.
 
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