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Bryant Crawford Hiring An Agent, Staying in Draft

Earl Grant and LaVall Jordan would be my top two (realistic) candidates as of now...I think.
 
Thank you Coach Manning; you tried.

I think we should gently ask him to step aside and do that thing that they did with a CFL football team (or some football league), where the fans got to choose the plays on their phones.

We all have the WF Gameday app; let’s tweak it so that we collectively can vote on starting lineups, inbounds plays, defensive strategies, etc. We even get to vote on whom to extend a scholarship offer to, and when to ask the Deacon to run in and kneecap Coach K to get a well-deserved technical. Who needs a coach? #powertothepeople
 
MichDeac25 said:
There are many jobs that require a college degree as a minimum requirement, including coaching at educational institutions. Maybe these guys are awesome with their money and end up owning businesses. I have no idea. But the paychecks for playing eventually end. People aren't going to live off Euro league money for the rest of their lives.
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Yeah, but those many jobs will accept a bachelors degree from any institution, not necessarily a Wake degree. Bryant, probably well knows that he isn't making the NBA this year or next no matter what, so he may as well go to Europe and start earning some money as an athlete. If he is not going to be an NBA star he's only got until his early 30's to earn $90k + per year as a basketball player so missing another year of income to stay in school for a degree that he can finish at 33 from a cheaper school doesn't make sense. The issue here for Bryant is what does he gain from staying (probably not much) and what does he lose by staying (maybe >$90000). That is not a clear cut obvious decision because of the "probably"s and the "maybe"s, but it is possible that he is better off in the long run. I think it is a less bad decision than Moore because I think that another year of Manning's tutelage could have improved Moore's skills to make him into a solid second rounder, 5.3 minutes a game with 0.8 points and 2.6 rebounds a game for a few years in the NBA. I think Moore hurt his pro-career by leaving but Bryant has little to gain by staying.
 
Crazy news but not unexpected. It wasn't long ago people were worried he'd be NBA bound this year.

Manning is gone. It would be a miracle for him to get to where he needs to be at the end of Year 5. He likely gives players sound advice about their careers but isn't good enough of a coach to keep them playing for him. That isn't going to change any time soon. Time to make a change.
 
WakeForest Fan said:
people are severely over-estimating a "degree" - wake or not. skills make money not a degree. see the trillion of debt in student loans. many of "degree" having baristas at your local coffee shop. for better or worse, crawford and moore are basketball players. that is their skill. they didn't come to wake to major in old mother where art thou crap. they came to play basketball in the ACC. staying another year on a team that may go 12-18 (if they were lucky) is not going to improve their future earning potential.
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I just disagree with all of this - and I think statistics would back me up. Student loan debt is not an issue here, since they are on scholarship - which is all the more reason for them to go ahead and finish their degree. They are not just starting out, deciding whether to get a degree - they are 75% of the way to the degree - which is all the more reason for them to go ahead and finish it out. Sure, lots of baristas have degrees, I'm not sure how that is relevant - you could give tons of anecdotal evidence both ways - millionaires without degrees and ditch diggers with degrees - so what? On average, a degree increases your earning potential - that is not a controversial or disputed fact.
 
Bryant can always go back to school (and doesn't have to be WF) and complete his degree. When/if he ever becomes motivated as a student, there will be plenty of ways for BC to get his degree. He played college basketball to become a pro basketball player, not to sell insurance.

That said, not sure what draft Crawford is "staying in". Would love to be proven wrong, but don't even see G-League as an option for Crawford. Hope his agent has connections in some lesser leagues. Kid has talent, but the world is full of 6-3 combo guards with his skills (and flaws). He needs to develop an elite skill (shooting, defense, handle, even hustle) to distinguish himself among that crowd. He's a long way from where he needs to be to make legit money playing hoop.
 

I think reasonable people can disagree on whether Crawford returning would help his stock. I personally don’t think so given how much he would need to force offense and his propensity for turnovers.

As to earnings potential, he’s clearly making more money playing professionally than almost all other entry level graduates. Whether his teams pay taxes or not, he’s going to live well. He’s betting on himself to suceed and be a high paid athlete. I don’t fault him for that confidence.

The best argument here is what he does in his post-basketball career without a degree. Maybe it hurts him, but maybe he wants to go down a second career path that doesn’t require a degree. I think if he stays in a basketball field then it doesn’t really matter. He can always go back for one year if that’s what he wants to do.

My biggest issue was you saying everyone is a moron for not agreeing with your assessment. God forbid equally intelligent people draw different conclusions.
 
buckets said:
yeah but if both stayed they could have potentially really raised their professional prospects AND get a wake forest degree

something is broken with the system or wake forest if our guys are better off trying to play in obscure euro leagues than play their senior year and finish their degrees at wake forest
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touche'
 
donaldross said:
Wake Forest basketball is going to suck for at least two more years minimum. Now is the time to be making major changes to the program. A great year to play games in Reynolds Gym & Greensboro & rip down the Joel. A great year to get in Wes Miller or Pat Kelsey at 400K.

We have to rip the band aid off and start over. We need leadership.
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I'm with Drew. Would prefer Kelsey to Miller but who cares at this point.

As for the impact of losing Crawford, I suspect we would have sucked regardless. This just ensures we won't endure the same level of disappointment because we will have lower expectations.
 
donaldross said:
Wake Forest basketball is going to suck for at least two more years minimum. Now is the time to be making major changes to the program. A great year to play games in Reynolds Gym & Greensboro & rip down the Joel. A great year to get in Wes Miller or Pat Kelsey at 400K.

We have to rip the band aid off and start over. We need leadership.
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At this point, I'd sign whatever petition or other document it would take to get this done.
 
scooter84 said:
I just disagree with all of this - and I think statistics would back me up. Student loan debt is not an issue here, since they are on scholarship - which is all the more reason for them to go ahead and finish their degree. They are not just starting out, deciding whether to get a degree - they are 75% of the way to the degree - which is all the more reason for them to go ahead and finish it out. Sure, lots of baristas have degrees, I'm not sure how that is relevant - you could give tons of anecdotal evidence both ways - millionaires without degrees and ditch diggers with degrees - so what? On average, a degree increases your earning potential - that is not a controversial or disputed fact.
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fair enough. however, i stand by the assertion that basketball players (majority - do not use the exceptions as the rule) at ACC schools are not there for the degree. they are attempting to improve their future ability to earn money playing basketball. which is 100% kosher. that's the whole problem with college basketball. they are not "student" athletes. stop calling them that. They have a skill that most of us do not have. same for computer programmers. no one would criticize a student who took a job at microsoft as a sophomore. why do it for a junior basketball player that may earn six figures in france?
 
Wrangor said:
Despite Crawford's clear court stupidity, he would have been our best guard, and arguably our best player this year. It is a pretty large stretch to say we are better without him. I guess you could make the argument that he was toxic to the team, but we have no validation of that for sure, and so that is a fools argument. He was a good talent, and when he played his game he made us a whole lot better. We will miss him on the court.
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IF, and I stress the word "IF" our coaching staff would take the time to teach fundamental offense and defense, the team might be better off playing as a team without Crawford. If we continue to play the "And1" style of basketball we currently employ, it doesn't much matter.
 
WakeForest Fan said:
fair enough. however, i stand by the assertion that basketball players (majority - do not use the exceptions as the rule) at ACC schools are not there for the degree. they are attempting to improve their future ability to earn money playing basketball. which is 100% kosher. that's the whole problem with college basketball. they are not "student" athletes. stop calling them that. They have a skill that most of us do not have. same for computer programmers. no one would criticize a student who took a job at microsoft as a sophomore. why do it for a junior basketball player that may earn six figures in france?
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Would be interesting to note what recent former ACC players that had brief Euro/G League stints (e.g. 3-5 years) are now doing as a profession. Any examples?
 
ManhassetDeac said:
I think reasonable people can disagree on whether Crawford returning would help his stock. I personally don’t think so given how much he would need to force offense and his propensity for turnovers.

As to earnings potential, he’s clearly making more money playing professionally than almost all other entry level graduates. Whether his teams pay taxes or not, he’s going to live well. He’s betting on himself to suceed and be a high paid athlete. I don’t fault him for that confidence.

The best argument here is what he does in his post-basketball career without a degree. Maybe it hurts him, but maybe he wants to go down a second career path that doesn’t require a degree. I think if he stays in a basketball field then it doesn’t really matter. He can always go back for one year if that’s what he wants to do.

My biggest issue was you saying everyone is a moron for not agreeing with your assessment. God forbid equally intelligent people draw different conclusions.
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Did I really call everyone a moron? I don't think so. I said it was an objectively bad decision and I think I said you were dumb as they were if you couldn't see that - and I stand by that. All you are saying is true - there are plenty of ways this could work out great for him - but you are making some assumptions about what he is going to be making and how he is going to be living that may or may not turn out to be true. In any event, I believe objective data would support my assertion that he would be better off staying and working on his game another year and finishing his degree. I could be wrong - it has happened once or twice before...
 
HoosierDeac said:
Would be interesting to note what recent former ACC players that had brief Euro/G League stints (e.g. 3-5 years) are now doing as a profession. Any examples?
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not sure how brief you want but let's use randolph childress as an example. is his "degree" from wake what got him the assistant coach job or his skills as a basketball player? honest question.
 
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