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Down Goes Silent Sam

I'm not fan of mass incarceration either. But, I believe we're in a society that's being governed by the minority because the majority doesn't vote. I wonder how many people involved in the protest last night voted in the state elections. I bet if a larger percentage of them and the rest of the state voted, we could get different laws and fewer confederate statues.

Considering it happened on a college campus, i would bet a large number of protesters were not old enough to vote in 2016.
 
Don't care about the vandalism, the statues don't have a place at public campuses or institutions. If this is how they come down, it's how they come down, if there were better means of taking them down it would have happened by now. Bigger things in our world to care about than some teenagers taking down racist statues.
 
I'm not fan of mass incarceration either. But, I believe we're in a society that's being governed by the minority because the majority doesn't vote. I wonder how many people involved in the protest last night voted in the state elections. I bet if a larger percentage of them and the rest of the state voted, we could get different laws and fewer confederate statues.

You can't say "im not a fan of mass incarceration" and then espouse an ideology that contributes to mass incarceration. Mass incarceration and felon disenfranchisement is a direct part of voter suppression. The answer is not to arrest more people so others will vote. The answer is to restore voting rights to the incarcerated.
 
You can't say "im not a fan of mass incarceration" and then espouse an ideology that contributes to mass incarceration. Mass incarceration and felon disenfranchisement is a direct part of voter suppression. The answer is not to arrest more people so others will vote. The answer is to restore voting rights to the incarcerated.

I'm a fan of getting people to vote. I think the American populace needs a shock to get it interested in the governing of our state/country.

I don't like the law that protects the statues. But it's a law. If you don't like it and want to do something like tearing down a statue, there are repercussions. Either deal with the repercussions and/or work to change them.
 
I'm a fan of getting people to vote. I think the American populace needs a shock to get it interested in the governing of our state/country.

I don't like the law that protects the statues. But it's a law. If you don't like it and want to do something like tearing down a statue, there are repercussions. Either deal with the repercussions and/or work to change them.

Your answer is insufficient in explaining why you think its appropriate to advance law and order politics to get people to vote, when law and order politics does the opposite.

Since today is the first day of the national prison strike, here is #10 on list of demands:

The voting rights of all confined citizens serving prison sentences, pretrial detainees, and so-called “ex-felons” must be counted. Representation is demanded. All voices count.
 
If prisoners count for drawing districts, they certainly should have the right to vote.
 
I have been reading Ron Chernow's excellent biography of Ulysses S. Grant. Grant probably did more for black Americans than any other president until Lyndon Johnson. Unfortunately, he saw Reconstruction falter and fail on his watch as political will to protect the freed population withered. He stated several times that the biggest mistake made in the aftermath of the war was allowing Southern states to count their black populations for purposes of representation while simultaneously making sure they never voted. He felt that Congress should have refused to allow full representation until the South showed that full protection for voting rights was in place. Imagine what a change in our history that would have been if implemented.
 
I have been reading Ron Chernow's excellent biography of Ulysses S. Grant. Grant probably did more for black Americans than any other president until Lyndon Johnson. Unfortunately, he saw Reconstruction falter and fail on his watch as political will to protect the freed population withered. He stated several times that the biggest mistake made in the aftermath of the war was allowing Southern states to count their black populations for purposes of representation while simultaneously making sure they never voted. He felt that Congress should have refused to allow full representation until the South showed that full protection for voting rights was in place. Imagine what a change in our history that would have been if implemented.

The recent and current Supreme Courts would have overturned such laws.
 
What's a vandalism against state property conviction, like a Class 2 misdemeanor? In the grand scheme of things that isn't going to wreck anyone's future. If whoever is doing it feels strongly enough to accept the repercussions, then they are free to pull it down. I doubt an Orange County judge is going to give them more than community service.
 
Don't care about the vandalism, the statues don't have a place at public campuses or institutions. If this is how they come down, it's how they come down, if there were better means of taking them down it would have happened by now. Bigger things in our world to care about than some teenagers taking down racist statues.
Absolutely right. Great post.
 
The same "patriots" who are outraged about Sam cheered wildly when Iraqis tore down statues of Saddam or Lenin and Stalin in Eastern Europe.
 
You can't say "im not a fan of mass incarceration" and then espouse an ideology that contributes to mass incarceration. Mass incarceration and felon disenfranchisement is a direct part of voter suppression. The answer is not to arrest more people so others will vote. The answer is to restore voting rights to the incarcerated.
Felony disenfranchisment was never meant to deter crime, it's just a method of systemic racism
 
And you are condoning their resort to vandalism rather than encouraging them to exercise the voice allocated to them under our system of government? WTF?

I'm cool with it, especially based on the realities of politics in NC

The NCGA has:

-Criminalized any removal Confederate statues- *including orderly removal processes driven by local votes.*
-Gerrymandered itself a veto-proof majority
-Threatened to impeach state supreme court judges who disagree w them
-Eroded the governor's authority so severely, GOP officials have come out against it
-Eradicated local decision making power on a huge swath of issues- labor law, housing, civil rights, etc.


The NC GOP is on a mission to get rid of local control, centering all power in the state with the NCGA - see Trudy Wade's effort to redistrict Greensboro/Guilford county to shift power and assert state control over local elections/decisions (this was rebuffed by the state supreme court, but a similar move against the Guilford Co BOE went through without legal challenge).

There is no "working with them" because they passed laws to criminalize any intent to remove statues (even through legal, local means and votes) and hold a veto-proof majority held by heavily gerrymandered districts.
 
I would also differentiate between pulling down a statue and bombing or burning a statue.

There is also the inferred threat to those who work in the clinic, even if bombing/burning happened after hours.
 
I would also differentiate between pulling down a statue and bombing or burning a statue.

There is also the inferred threat to those who work in the clinic, even if bombing/burning happened after hours.

Meh. All the same to Junebug.
 
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