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Down Goes Silent Sam

Meh take it somewhere else. MLK himself preached about the consequences of civil disobedience. Change the laws (if you can and a party doesn’t unilaterally change every rule out there) but don’t whine about the consequences of civil disobedience when everyone knows what they are.

Take it to a jury for potential nullification for all I care.
 
Meh take it somewhere else. MLK himself preached about the consequences of civil disobedience. Change the laws (if you can and a party doesn’t unilaterally change every rule out there) but don’t whine about the consequences of civil disobedience when everyone knows what they are.

Take it to a jury for potential nullification for all I care.

Why would I "take it somewhere else" in a thread about civil disobedience? What MLK speech/writing are you thinking of? Discussing the realities of the 1960s' consequences of civil disobedience does not mean that MLK supported the enforcement/prosecution of unjust laws.
 
The laws against destroying public property is not an unjust law. You can't have mobs tearing down buildings.

however, being that most of these people don't have felony records, it wouldn't be surprising to see them get a fine and an expungement of their records after a short period of time .
 
Meh take it somewhere else. MLK himself preached about the consequences of civil disobedience. Change the laws (if you can and a party doesn’t unilaterally change every rule out there) but don’t whine about the consequences of civil disobedience when everyone knows what they are.

Take it to a jury for potential nullification for all I care.

"I know I'm going to jail for something I believe in" is not the same as "They should go to jail for something they believe in."
 
The laws against destroying public property is not an unjust law. You can't have mobs tearing down buildings.

however, being that most of these people don't have felony records, it wouldn't be surprising to see them get a fine and an expungement of their records after a short period of time .

Textbook example of how liberals contribute to mass incarceration. Nevermind all the systemic racism. We have laws that need to be followed!
 
So does MHB want us to repeal vandalism laws or just not prosecute vandals ?
 
MLK himself preached about the consequences of civil disobedience. Change the laws (if you can and a party doesn’t unilaterally change every rule out there) but don’t whine about the consequences of civil disobedience when everyone knows what they are.

link?
 
This has ZERO to do with mass incarceration. People throughout US history have gone to jail willingly to get laws changed.

This is nothing like the immoral drug laws or stop and frisk or giving out BS tickets to minorities or giving people of color and poor people disproportionate sentences.

Since this is OK with you, would it be OK for neo-Nazis to vandalize and destroy the office of a local Democratic Socialist candidate?
 
This has ZERO to do with mass incarceration. People throughout US history have gone to jail willingly to get laws changed.

This is nothing like the immoral drug laws or stop and frisk or giving out BS tickets to minorities or giving people of color and poor people disproportionate sentences.

Since this is OK with you, would it be OK for neo-Nazis to vandalize and destroy the office of a local Democratic Socialist candidate?

It has everything to do with mass incarceration.

This is a trick question because antifa super soldiers would stop them before they could destroy the office.
 
Mass incarcerations is about wrongful incarcerations and unfair, racially based prison sentences.

It's not a trick question at all. Answer it directly. Is it OK for Neo-Nazis to destroy DS property and not be charged for it?

You are de facto supporting the use of violence. That won't get you anywhere.
 
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I think there were other tactics that could have been used to put pressure on UNC and the state short of mob violence.

Mob violence?


Careful with those pearls.


And no, UNC’s hands were tied by laws passed by an illegally gerrymandered legislature.
 
vandalism of these statues is just an illustration of how a representative democracy fails even at the lowest, simplest levels. if they system worked, there would be a legal solution. instead, a bunch of dumb fuck OWGs just block up the system

^This. The NC legislature passed a law making it extremely difficult, if not virtually impossible, to take down the statue by peaceful means. At that point I'm not sure what peaceful means to remove the statue were left. This legislature has made it clear that they don't care about public protests or anything their critics say, so it's not as if student protests were going to do any good.
Also, for anyone who wonders why this statue needed to come down, here are the actual words of one of the speakers at the dedication ceremony for the statue back in 1913:

“One hundred yards from where we stand, less than 90 days perhaps after my return from Appomattox, I horse-whipped a negro wench until her skirts hung in shreds, because upon the streets of this quiet village she had publicly insulted and maligned a Southern lady,” Julius Carr said when he delivered the dedication speech on the steps of Silent Sam in 1913.

And another part of the 1913 dedication speech for the statue: "The present generation, I am persuaded, scarcely takes note of what the Confederate soldier meant to the welfare of the Anglo Saxon race during the four years immediately succeeding the war...their courage and steadfastness saved the very life of the Anglo Saxon race in the South." "The four years immediately succeeding the war" refers to the terrorization of blacks and white Republicans by the Ku Klux Klan, which worked to change the dominance of whites in the south.
 
Mass incarcerations is about wrongful incarcerations and unfair, racially based prison sentences.

It's not a trick question at all. Answer it directly. Is it OK for Neo-Nazis to destroy DS property and not be charged for it?

You are de facto supporting the use of violence. That won't get you anywhere.

I think you misunderstand the history of mass incarceration. Neither party has a moral highground. Part of the contribution to mass incarceration is the liberal belief that race blind laws can be implemented in a way that is not systemically racist. Racist sentencing guidelines occurred because they were under the guise of equal implementation.
 
So when numbers says "prosecute" them because they broke the law, it kind of ignores the systemic racism that exists in the enforcement of law and order policy. You can't possibly say that because i don't support mass incarceration, that I support violent crime.
 
So when numbers says "prosecute" them because they broke the law, it kind of ignores the systemic racism that exists in the enforcement of law and order policy. You can't possibly say that because i don't support mass incarceration, that I support violent crime.

You brought up "antifa super soldiers" stopping Neo-Nazis. that's violence.

Prosecuting the people who brought down the statue is not about "systemic racism" no matter how much you want it to be. It has nothing to do with "mass incarceration" either. This is about a specific event.

I've been involved in an actual "mass incarceration" when Nixon swept the streets of DC and sent thousands to RFK holding pens. I was targeted in South Africa during apartheid by the security forces for bringing multi-racial musicians together.

Joburg and Soweto were obviously massively scarier than DC was, but I have put my life and freedom on the line for causes.

Have you?

P.S. My life was also threatened by Tom Metzger and the White Aryan Resistance for helping with a book and publicity written by one of the worst of the worst who had an epiphany.
 
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I always took MLK's discussion of civil disobedience in letter from Birmingham jail to inherently include that individuals who engaged in civil disobedience were accepting the penalties and consequences of the community yet were appealing to a greater, more just law.
 
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