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Jaylen Hoard - He Gone

Any discussion of the benefits of Hoard returning to college cannot ignore the fact that Manning will still be his coach and Manning sucks at coaching. Like, he's really really bad.
 
birdman said:
Any discussion of the benefits of Hoard returning to college cannot ignore the fact that Manning will still be his coach and Manning sucks at coaching. Like, he's really really bad.
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Along with that is the fact that Ryan Horn is reputed to be one of the best strength and conditioning coaches around. He's gotta be something of an attraction to return.
 
tigerswood said:
Yeah that's just "official" practice hours though. They can spend as much time as they want playing pickup games, practicing by themselves, with their non-staff shooting coaches, etc. Obviously it's not the same, but it's also not like these G league dudes are out there playing/practicing for 10 hours a day.
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And even the official part isn’t that restrictive - it’s 4 hours per day. There’s a difference in the amount those in the G league practice compared to college during the school year, but the difference isn’t that great.
 
Hoard on a plane right now fom CLT to LAX.

Bad t-storms rolling through right now so might be delayed.
 
Probably plans to miss class the rest of the week.
 
Shorty said:
Which is why I posted that he has nothing to gain by spending another year here.
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Manning has done a great job of improving several guys who have made good money if they will put in the effort required. We can't downplay what he did with John Collins and his $6 million contract with the Atlanta Hawks after only 2 years. Nor can we downplay the 4 year, $2 million contract Dinos Mitiglou got from the top Greek league team. His team also won the title this past season. It would have really helped Doral Moore to have stayed one more year in what he might have gotten & how he would have improved. He would have definitely helped the Deacs last season. Crawford was a different story. He was just too hardheaded to be helped IMHO. Too selfish.

At this point with all the good players who have declared, I just don't see Hoard in either round getting drafted.
 
TheReff said:
Manning has done a great job of improving several guys who have made good money if they will put in the effort required. We can't downplay what he did with John Collins and his $6 million contract with the Atlanta Hawks after only 2 years. Nor can we downplay the 4 year, $2 million contract Dinos Mitiglou got from the top Greek league team. His team also won the title this past season. It would have really helped Doral Moore to have stayed one more year in what he might have gotten & how he would have improved. He would have definitely helped the Deacs last season. Crawford was a different story. He was just too hardheaded to be helped IMHO. Too selfish.

At this point with all the good players who have declared, I just don't see Hoard in either round getting drafted.
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Hmm. I wonder how much later John Collins would have been drafted had he gone to a different D1 school. He might have learned to put that great athleticism to use on defense as well as offense.

How many points per game is Dinos averaging in Greece?
 
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knowell said:
Hmm. I wonder how much later John Collins would have been drafted had he gone to a different D1 school. He might have learned to put that great athleticism to use on defense as well as offense.
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He hasn't learned yet.
 
knowell said:
Hmm. I wonder how much later John Collins would have been drafted had he gone to a different D1 school. He might have learned to put that great athleticism to use on defense as well as offense.

How many points per game is Dinos averaging in Greece?
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Why would John Collins have wanted to go to another school just to be drafted later? Then he would have made less money. He had a meteoric rise his sophomore year as it was from not being mentioned to being drafted #19 by the Hawks. They just picked up his option for next season and he will make $2.7 million. He averaged 19.5 points & 9.8 rebounds in his 2nd season. I would say he is doing pretty good.

Dinos averaged 15 minutes per game, 6 points & 4 rebounds for the top team in Greece in his 2nd season. Plus a nice $500 k per year!
 
TheReff said:
Why would John Collins have wanted to go to another school just to be drafted later? Then he would have made less money. He had a meteoric rise his sophomore year as it was from not being mentioned to being drafted #19 by the Hawks. They just picked up his option for next season and he will make $2.7 million. He averaged 19.5 points & 9.8 rebounds in his 2nd season. I would say he is doing pretty good.

Dinos averaged 15 minutes per game, 6 points & 4 rebounds for the top team in Greece in his 2nd season. Plus a nice $500 k per year!
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danny, ronnie or donny who has the tastier nuts?
 
There is such a difference between a late 1st rd pick and a 2nd rd pick when it comes to salary. A good example to use is Malik Beasley. Roughly speaking, he had a frosh campaign at FSU that is similar to Hoard. He definitely COULD have stayed another year at FSU, but chose to leave after one year. To be honest, I can't even remember his game at FSU. But, he did get drafted w the 19th pick on his potential despite a stress fracture in his foot. It has taken him 3 years to figure out the NBA, get stronger, improve his game, and he has had to do it with long stretches in the D league (Sioux Falls) - BUT - and this is a big BUT, he got to do it while earning $1.7 million plus per year. Now, he has one more year on his rookie contract and if he stays healthy and productive, he is going to get PAID year after next.

If Beaseey had been a 2nd round pick, he would have been doing all this the last 2 or 3 years while making significantly less with much less guaranteed money. He probably would have been cut as he had almost no impact on the Nuggets. Admittedly, the 2nd round contract structure has changed even since 2016 when Beasley came out and there is a lot more money and guaranteed money in a lot of these contracts, but my guess on Hoard is that he is going to get three or four things to work on from the draft camp: his handles, his outside shooting, decision making, and one other. Honestly, if he significantly improves just one of those, I think he moves into the late 1st round next year.

It is easy to say, if he has confidence in his game, then he should ... honestly, I am sure he has confidence in his game and that doesn't dictate his decision one way or the other. He could have confidence in his game and decide to go this year, get drafted in the 2nd round, and grind it out for two or three years to make it into an NBA rotation, or he could come back to improve his draft stock - it becomes a strategy of what you want the next few years to look like. Are you willing to defer for a year some quality guaranteed money ($600,000?) in the desire to fulfill a dream (NBA lottery) and the chance at way more guaranteed money from the start? Not sure what I would do in his situation. It would help if I knew there was a staff behind me that could def help me improve. One of the things we DO have is a great strength and conditioning program and unfortunately, I don't expect that will be part of the message that Hoard gets from draft camp. Sure, he could get stronger, but that's not really a weakness.
 
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Wakeforest22890 said:
Neither Crawford nor Doral were going to stick around Danny any longer than they had to.
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Bit of a cliched response. It is low hanging fruit to chalk it up to Manning. Wake campus life plays a role as well. One of the reasons we kept Duncan for four years is he simply loved campus life. In those days, ALL freshmen were assigned randomish roommates and athletes didn't have other scholly athletes as their roommate and they didn't live in their own dorms. That is not so anymore. Honestly, it is a double-edged sword. I have some memories partying with scholly athletes that was surely a distraction to their athletic focus. I also think some recruits might shy away from that type of "exposure" if seeking out a one-and-done fly-by college experience.

But Craw and Doral were done with Wake Forest as much as they were done with Manning. Winning and the hope of winning does change one's experience too. In hindsight, it was probably the right decision for both. Neither were likely to improve their draft stock by coming back and having similar years to the ones they had as juniors.
 
It may be cliched but it's true. Neither got along with Danny (particularly Doral) and neither was the least interested in being around him another year.
 
jaybone said:
Bit of a cliched response. It is low hanging fruit to chalk it up to Manning. Wake campus life plays a role as well. One of the reasons we kept Duncan for four years is he simply loved campus life. In those days, ALL freshmen were assigned randomish roommates and athletes didn't have other scholly athletes as their roommate and they didn't live in their own dorms. That is not so anymore. Honestly, it is a double-edged sword. I have some memories partying with scholly athletes that was surely a distraction to their athletic focus. I also think some recruits might shy away from that type of "exposure" if seeking out a one-and-done fly-by college experience.

But Craw and Doral were done with Wake Forest as much as they were done with Manning. Winning and the hope of winning does change one's experience too. In hindsight, it was probably the right decision for both. Neither were likely to improve their draft stock by coming back and having similar years to the ones they had as juniors.
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The statement about roommate assignments when Duncan was there is inaccurate.
 
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