• Welcome to OGBoards 10.0, keep in mind that we will be making LOTS of changes to smooth out the experience here and make it as close as possible functionally to the old software, but feel free to drop suggestions or requests in the Tech Support subforum!

2020 Democratic Presidential Nominees

Ph, I apologize if i'm making you repeat arguments you've had with others, but i think it'd be a benefit to all of us and the discussion if you could expand a little more on your thoughts re: Bernie and race. The BKF thing is not helpful at all. And although I understand your perception of Bernie as weak on race issues, I don't understand it at all. It's even more confounding when candidates like Biden/Clinton, imo, have a much worse track record on race.

So if you don't see a problem with similarly aligned DSA types, then it doesn't seem to be so much of a criticism of his platform/policies. Then what actions/statements/other shape your opinion of him so negatively?
 
And at risk of perpetually being seen as defender of all things Bernie, there is plenty to criticize, and I'm split on the question of whether my DSA chapter should endorse a Bernie campaign.
 
Bernie will be 79 on election day in 2020. Sorry, but that's too old at this point in history.

Whether you like it or not, having the word "socialist" as part of your political description will not fly nationally at this time. He will get totally abused in hardcore ads.
 
Bernie will be 79 on election day in 2020. Sorry, but that's too old at this point in history.

Whether you like it or not, having the word "socialist" as part of your political description will not fly nationally at this time. He will get totally abused in hardcore ads.

Racking my brain thinking of another old white guy "totally abused" by negative campaign ads. After 2016 I don't think anyone has a clue what makes someone "unelectable" in the general election. Those types of comments are interesting to me because I think Bernie will have a much more difficult time winning voters like you, RJ, in the Democratic primary, then he would have difficulty winning independent voters in the general. I honestly think there is more energy for populism in the general election voting base than in the Democratic voting base, and the DNC has historically set themselves up as gatekeepers to block any independent left candidate from gaining legitimacy.
 
Last edited:
Bernie will be 79 on election day in 2020. Sorry, but that's too old at this point in history.

Whether you like it or not, having the word "socialist" as part of your political description will not fly nationally at this time. He will get totally abused in hardcore ads.

Yeah, I’m not a Bernie 2020 guy. He is just way too old. I want him to groom some younger talent and stump for them. Pick his own successor and help them win the primary.
 
You'd be right about me not voting for Bernie without something miraculous happening. I don't think he has a shot in hell at beating Trump. Plus, Trump will have a field day attacking Bernie.

Hundreds of millions of dollars would be spent trying to connect Bernie to Castro, Lenin, Stalin and more. It doesn't matter whether they are true or not constant repetition in battleground states will create problems.

If the Dems didn't have such a long history of old guys losing the first time they run, I'd be all in on Sherrod Brown. He could stand up and go toe-to-toe with Trump.

I wish there was someone under 50 who could stand up to Trump and give it back to him. As I've said many times, we need a generational change.
 
Dude, that hurts. Do you really think Bernie is/was as racist as BKF?

No. My point is you can’t ignore what someone has or hasn’t done recently because of what they did 50+ years ago.

Ph, I apologize if i'm making you repeat arguments you've had with others, but i think it'd be a benefit to all of us and the discussion if you could expand a little more on your thoughts re: Bernie and race. The BKF thing is not helpful at all. And although I understand your perception of Bernie as weak on race issues, I don't understand it at all. It's even more confounding when candidates like Biden/Clinton, imo, have a much worse track record on race.

So if you don't see a problem with similarly aligned DSA types, then it doesn't seem to be so much of a criticism of his platform/policies. Then what actions/statements/other shape your opinion of him so negatively?

I don’t know why you want me to keep explaining things. It’s really not about him. It’s about freeing up room or others who should be better.

Yeah, I’m not a Bernie 2020 guy. He is just way too old. I want him to groom some younger talent and stump for them. Pick his own successor and help them win the primary.

This.
 
Last edited:
Platform wise, Bernie doesn't have a "successor", though. You all are just saying you won't vote for him because he's too old - which is your right to do. It's just confusing when you say "Im not a Bernie guy" and your reasoning is age, and not policy. I want a younger successor to Bernie as well, but if Bernie is the progressive candidate i'm going to support him over a younger centrist.
 
Last edited:
And at risk of perpetually being seen as defender of all things Bernie, there is plenty to criticize, and I'm split on the question of whether my DSA chapter should endorse a Bernie campaign.

Wait for candidates to declare first. That’s ridiculous. This type of thing is what I’m afraid of. If Bernie declares and DSA chapters leap to endorse him, other Progressives will be hesistant to run.
 
Wait for candidates to declare first. That’s ridiculous. This type of thing is what I’m afraid of. If Bernie declares and DSA chapters leap to endorse him, other Progressives will be hesistant to run.

To clarify, I was talking about a future hypothetical that is looking more and more likely. Our chapter is supposed to only endorse socialist candidates. Despite RJ's fears about people tying Bernie to Lenin, I personally don't think Bernie is a socialist and I think he will shy away from the label. I don't want DSA as an org to be stuck in national situation like what happened in NY where you had DSA endorse Cynthia Nixon over an actual socialist.
 
Platform wise, Bernie doesn't have a "successor", though. You all are just saying you won't vote for him because he's too old - which is your right to do. It's just confusing when you say "Im not a Bernie, guy" and your reasoning is age, and not policy. I want a younger successor to Bernie as well, but if Bernie is the progressive candidate i'm going to support him over a younger centrist.

Of course, if Bernie is the most progressive candidate he will have my support, but I am hoping it won’t come to that. I am hoping that someone else, I don’t know who, will emerge and Bernie will step aside and support them.
 
Platform wise, Bernie doesn't have a "successor", though. You all are just saying you won't vote for him because he's too old - which is your right to do. It's just confusing when you say "Im not a Bernie guy" and your reasoning is age, and not policy. I want a younger successor to Bernie as well, but if Bernie is the progressive candidate i'm going to support him over a younger centrist.

So Bernie is a 77 year old who has been a politician for 37 years and he doesn’t have a successor. That’s a problem. He’s been going around the country endorsing candidates. Ideally he would have a few younger candidates he could support for President.

Nothing you and MHB are saying convinces me that a young progressive candidate will emerge. That’s a shame because there is a real opportunity here for the progressive movement. Bernie and AOC are good hype people for DSA but someone else would be a better fit in the primary.
 
Just spitballing here but maybe the problem of a lack of progressive candidates is more the fault of the Democratic Party and not the independent senator from Vermont.
 
Just spitballing here but maybe the problem of a lack of progressive candidates is more the fault of the Democratic Party and not the independent senator from Vermont.

Who says there is a lack of candidates? We have no idea how many candidates there are. You can blame the Dems for the lack of Dem candidates in 2016. If there is a lack of Progressive candidates in 2020, then you can blame Progressives. If Progressives galvanize around Bernie and shut out others, they deserve the blame.
 
Who says there is a lack of candidates? We have no idea how many candidates there are. You can blame the Dems for the lack of Dem candidates in 2016. If there is a lack of Progressive candidates in 2020, then you can blame Progressives. If Progressives galvanize around Bernie and shut out others, they deserve the blame.
You're arguing a strange theory of responsibility. Somehow the lack of a younger progressive frontrunning candidate for President is Bernie's fault? How is that? Are Obama or Hillary responsible for the current crop of centrist front running candidates? Was Bill Clinton responsible for Obama? I don't think that's how this works. It isnt as if Bernie is publicly discouraging other Progressive candidates from running. He hasnt commented on Richard Ojeda or Sherrod Brown, Elizabeth Warren or Barbara Lee, or Tulsi Gabbard. So what are you talking about?

I understand what you want, but you haven't made the logical case of how and why Bernie was responsible for giving that to you. Did I miss the press release where Hillary named her successor?
 
Last edited:
MHMD, you’re purposefully being dense. Stop it. One of the main criticisms I’ve levied against Hillary and Obama and the Dem establishment is that they didn’t do enough to build a bench. You know what I’m talking about. Stop pretending you don’t. It’s not a good look. Pretty pathetic that you seem to be fine with progressives duplicating establishment mistakes.
 
Last edited:
MHMD, you’re purposefully being dense. Stop it. One of the main criticisms I’ve levied against Hillary and Obama and the Dem establishment is that they didn’t do enough to build a bench. You know what I’m talking about. Stop pretending you don’t. It’s not a good look. Pretty pathetic that you seem to be fine with progressives duplicating establishment mistakes.
It's a valid critique of a political party, but it's a nonsense excuse IMO to call someone a bad candidate for not finding their own successor. Bernie has more name recognition now than any of the Dem field besides Joe Biden. He can't just transfer that name recognition to anyone he chooses, and he certainly shouldnt forfeit his name recognition, the greatest advantage a leftist has had in the modern era, just because of his age.
 
I’m not saying he’s a bad candidate. He shouldn’t be a candidate. I’m saying he’s a poor de facto leader of a promising movement.

Bernie is a unique political figure. Most politicians are liked because of their personality or how they made their constituents feel. People like Bernie mostly (if not solely) because of his ideology. So if his ideology is popular, why can’t he find a more likable person to promote it?
 
Back
Top