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WHY is he still our basketball coach?

PhDeac said:
There’s little downside to doing it now. Get a good day of coverage. Get the players hopeful about next season. Give fans a reason to watch. Dispel the idea that our program is just pushing a boulder up a hill. Get commentators talking about the future. Acknowledge there is problem with the program.
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#culture
 
PhDeac said:
There’s little downside to doing it now. Get a good day of coverage. Get the players hopeful about next season. Give fans a reason to watch. Dispel the idea that our program is just pushing a boulder up a hill. Get commentators talking about the future. Acknowledge there is problem with the program.
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Makes sense from a fan (and potentially team) engagement perspective. I wonder if contract-wise would be a lot more expensive to fire midway through the season rather than after.
 
PhDeac said:
There’s little downside to doing it now. Get a good day of coverage. Get the players hopeful about next season. Give fans a reason to watch. Dispel the idea that our program is just pushing a boulder up a hill. Get commentators talking about the future. Acknowledge there is problem with the program.
Click to expand...

I'm not going to fall on my sword over this but there are a few downsides.
- Other programs know our current players are open season for poaching
- Even as bad as DM has been, it's not like we are firing a no name like bzzzz
- Coaches that are planning on moving up would have nearly 2 months to think about whether Wake is an option, by time we could show up with a check they could have already ruled us out.
- Just my opinion that, being able to talk to a coach and make him an offer that he can immediately accept is far better for our situation.

How many programs can their coaches during the season, especially P5 programs? We know UCLA did. Pitt,where everyone knew Stallings was the wrong guy waited until the end of the season, where they went 0-18 and lost at home by 50+ in one game.

He was owed $9M+

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...burgh-and-now-hes-out/?utm_term=.b261829db741

Also note how Pitt played the buy out. I'm sure DM has a 'firing with cause' clause in his contract. We can't be that stupid. Not that I know what cause would be for DM, he doesn't say much, ever, especially on the court.
 
Those aren’t downsides. Our players leave when the coaches stay. The national media is turning against Manning. It’s more likely coaches will turn us down with little warning than if they have time to do the research.
 
PhDeac said:
Those aren’t downsides. Our players leave when the coaches stay. The national media is turning against Manning. It’s more likely coaches will turn us down with little warning than if they have time to do the research.
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Agree - every knows he is dead man walking so we might as well get on with it. Only wrinkle would be the contractual situation.
 
Henry Chinaski said:
Agree - every knows he is dead man walking so we might as well get on with it. Only wrinkle would be the contractual situation.
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If the contract is an issue, don't fire him but announce that he's done at the end of the season.
 
RacerDeac said:
If the contract is an issue, don't fire him but announce that he's done at the end of the season.
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Exactly. And Manning can choose to resign.
 
Coaches have agents who watch this stuff closely. Firing him now is only going to answer their lingering questions about whether or not there is actually going to be an opening at Wake Forest. None of them will rule us out without gathering some basic info. This isn’t a normal job hire and saying “they might rule us out before we get a chance to make our case” is treating it like one.

Firing now only demonstrates that we are actually serious about basketball which is what an agent would want to see.
 
TBDeac said:
Makes sense from a fan (and potentially team) engagement perspective. I wonder if contract-wise would be a lot more expensive to fire midway through the season rather than after.
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Of course it would be. Manning was never getting fired mid-season, but doing it now would be nuts. If you're going to eat a ton of cash and fire him early, the time to do it was weeks ago. There is zero chance Manning doesn't coach through the end of the season.
 
Thanks to UCLA we have the data.

https://watchstadium.com/news/an-ex...ing-changes-in-college-basketball-01-02-2019/

A couple of points
- mid-season coaching changes (not just firings, such as retirements) only happen on average once per year.
- Some of coaches that had been floated in past coaching searches, IIRC, are on the list Anthony Grant and Groce
- Jerry Wainwright at DePaul
- While the article notes that most programs returned to the NCAA's in 3-4 years, from that list I think the only coaches hired with significant success were Bo Ryan, Tom Crean and Greg Gard. Ryan and Gard were both at Wisc after the previous coach retired in season.

I'd be happy to know it's a done deal, but I don't think there is evidence that it gives you leverage (i.e. you get an advantage in hiring or the program turns around faster)
 
We need a twitter account in the style of 'Did Team X win last night?' that provides daily updates on DM's employment status.
 
Deac83 said:
I'm not going to fall on my sword over this but there are a few downsides.
- Other programs know our current players are open season for poaching
- Even as bad as DM has been, it's not like we are firing a no name like bzzzz
- Coaches that are planning on moving up would have nearly 2 months to think about whether Wake is an option, by time we could show up with a check they could have already ruled us out.
- Just my opinion that, being able to talk to a coach and make him an offer that he can immediately accept is far better for our situation.

How many programs can their coaches during the season, especially P5 programs? We know UCLA did. Pitt,where everyone knew Stallings was the wrong guy waited until the end of the season, where they went 0-18 and lost at home by 50+ in one game.

He was owed $9M+

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...burgh-and-now-hes-out/?utm_term=.b261829db741

Also note how Pitt played the buy out. I'm sure DM has a 'firing with cause' clause in his contract. We can't be that stupid. Not that I know what cause would be for DM, he doesn't say much, ever, especially on the court.
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Yow fired Gottfried exactly two years ago (in the middle of the season) if you guys can take any positives from that.
 
DeacDaddy said:
Coaches have agents who watch this stuff closely. Firing him now is only going to answer their lingering questions about whether or not there is actually going to be an opening at Wake Forest. None of them will rule us out without gathering some basic info. This isn’t a normal job hire and saying “they might rule us out before we get a chance to make our case” is treating it like one.

Firing now only demonstrates that we are actually serious about basketball which is what an agent would want to see.
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You sure they haven't ruled us out before even considering manning might be gone? I don't think serious coaches will touch WFU with Wellman at the helm. Add to that the past 9 years have destroyed any history, quality or recruiting value that we had. Now it's a very tough rebuild with a destroyed fanbase, disinterested AD and nightmare sell to recruits. Who wants that?
 
Last few games:
13-12 ND - road game
18-8 NCState - road game
11-14 Miami - W-S
17-8 'Cuse - W-S
23-2 Duke - road game
20-5 FSU - W-S

I only see a chance to beat Miami, maybe.
 
GoDeacsGo said:
Last few games:
13-12 ND - road game
18-8 NCState - road game
11-14 Miami - W-S
17-8 'Cuse - W-S
23-2 Duke - road game
20-5 FSU - W-S

I only see a chance to beat Miami, maybe.
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kenpom probability
16%
6%
35%
23%
0.2%
13%

is a 9-22 season bad?
 
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