Jeffrey Epstein

Seriously, fuck Bill Clinton. The fucking rubes keep saying “Clinton did this” or “Clinton did that”. Nothing came out until he was in his second term...it was done, gonzo. If this ruffled the rubes so bad then why is Trump OK when we are FUCKING VOTING NOW!!! This should outrage the deplorable, but Noooooo....their bigotry outweighs all.

God damn, I was a republican just a few years ago and I am so far from them now. Good riddance!

warak said:

Seriously, fuck Bill Clinton. The fucking rubes keep saying “Clinton did this” or “Clinton did that”. Nothing came out until he was in his second term...it was done, gonzo. If this ruffled the rubes so bad then why is Trump OK when we are FUCKING VOTING NOW!!! This should outrage the deplorable, but Noooooo....their bigotry outweighs all.

God damn, I was a republican just a few years ago and I am so far from them now. Good riddance!

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That's simply not true.

WFU71 said:

That's simply not true.

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None of the stuff he was impeached on. It was a witch hunt that ended with one stained dress.

WFU71 said:

That's simply not true.

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Do you think that what came out was impeachable?

Strickland33 said:

Do you think that what came out was impeachable?

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Of course not in regards to the initial allegations from Paula Jones. I was responding to warak's statement that nothing came out about Clinton's alleged misconduct until his second term. The truth is Paula Jones filed suit against Clinton in his first term (1994).

In Clinton's second term, Bill testified in the Jones matter that he didn't have a sexual affair with Monica Lewinsky, a denial that, after his affair with Lewinsky was subsequently exposed, led to his impeachment for perjury and obstruction of justice. While he certainly did lie over his involvement with Monica, I was conflicted at the time over his guilt or innocence when it came to impeachment. I became president of a decent-sized health care company the same year Clinton was elected POTUS. Frankly, a number of women who worked for me were more than willing to jump in the sack with me. While I declined their offers, I know several guys in similar positions who took the bait. They were, for the most part, effective leaders who lost their discipline in a moment of weakness.

I was in the office of my board chairman when the Senate acquitted Clinton. We had a long discussion about the temptations that come with power and how easy it would be to say yes if some starry-eyed young lady wanted to give you a bj.

In retrospect, I believe Clinton was and is, a complete asshole who uses his power to hit (and possibly) force himself on women. I've met some others like that and they're assholes, too.

Junebug said:

It’s not a good look to downplay one man’s obstruction of justice while criticizing another’s. Bill Clinton should have been convicted and Trump should be impeached and convicted. To think Bubba shouldn’t have been impeached but Trump should is nothing but political hypocrisy.

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I agree. Clinton’s lies were far less substantial but they were still lies under oath. I think the big distinction in people’s minds is that Trump’s lies and obstruction are mostly are to cover up other illegal activities and Clinton’s lies were to cover up an affair that would have been embarrassing but it wasn’t illegal. Clinton lies about stupid shit, Trump is lying about substantial illegal shit.

Given the horndogs Jefferson, Franklin and other Founding Fathers were, I kinda doubt they ever thought a POTUS would be asked about his sex life and that lying about it would be a "high crime or misdemeanor".

birdman said:

I agree. Clinton’s lies were far less substantial but they were still lies under oath. I think the big distinction in people’s minds is that Trump’s lies and obstruction are mostly are to cover up other illegal activities and Clinton’s lies were to cover up an affair that would have been embarrassing but it wasn’t illegal. Clinton lies about stupid shit, Trump is lying about substantial illegal shit.

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No, Clinton should not have been impeached for lying about a hummer, especially not with the hypocritical Ken Starr leading the charge. I'm no fan of the man, or at least not any longer, but that just isn't serious enough to remove a president from office.

That said, I get the feeling he's in much greater danger from his association with Epstein than Trump is. Trump was apparently 1 of the few rich and famous friends of Epstein who was cooperative with the investigation a decade ago, whereas Clinton has apparently already lied about how often was was with Epstein from his statement last week. Still don't know why he released such a specific statement. That said, let's not assume that all of these rich and famous people are pedophiles and do away with due process. Seems to me there are 3 basic categories his friends could fall into: folks who hobnobbed with Epstein at social functions; guys who had consensual sex with women at his sex parties; and guys who had sex with minors or who raped women of any age. It's category 3 where I want to see folks prosecuted.

Strickland33 said:

Do you think that what came out was impeachable?

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I believe that by today’s standards it is, and should be. Not the lying, just using the worlds most powerful position of power to pressure an intern into sexual act should be impeachable. That blurs the line of consensual sex, and the victim herself has even come forward saying as much.

WFcatamount22 said:

I believe that by today’s standards it is, and should be. Not the lying, just using the worlds most powerful position of power to pressure an intern into sexual act should be impeachable. That blurs the line of consensual sex, and the victim herself has even come forward saying as much.

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Except that's not the case. Before leaving for DC, Monica Lewinsky bragged to her friends about having her "presidential kneepads". There are lots of reasons that Clinton shouldn't have done her, but to characterize it like it was all his idea are disputed by Lewinsky before and after it happened.

Weird hill to die on but to each their own

boomers man

Yeah, I was between 7 and 15 when Bill Clinton was president, so needless to say, I didn't really have an opinion on the matter. I don't think many millennials are lining up to defend him, especially given all that has been exposed in the context of the last few years. I do find it strange though that when I talked to my Trump supporting, hometown friends in 2016, they all looked back on Bill with admiration. Strange indeed...

Demonwolverine said:

Yeah, I was between 7 and 15 when Bill Clinton was president, so needless to say, I didn't really have an opinion on the matter. I don't think many millennials are lining up to defend him, especially given all that has been exposed in the context of the last few years. I do find it strange though that when I talked to my Trump supporting, hometown friends in 2016, they all looked back on Bill with admiration. Strange indeed...

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It is a weird phenomenon. I know people (all Republicans and now Trumpites) who loathed Clinton when he was POTUS, and were indignant that he wasn't removed from office during the impeachment crisis, but in the years since their attitude towards him has softened considerably. Not towards his wife, though - they still despise her with a passion.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/07/jeffrey-epstein-case-grows-more-grotesque

Likely within days, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit will release almost 2,000 pages of documents that could reveal sexual abuse by “numerous prominent American politicians, powerful business executives, foreign presidents, a well-known prime minister, and other world leaders,” according to the three-judge panel's ruling. The documents were filed during a civil defamation lawsuit brought by Epstein accuser Virginia Roberts Giuffre, a former Mar-a-Lago locker-room attendant, against Epstein’s former girlfriend and alleged madam, Ghislaine Maxwell.

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Bring them all down.

Barr needs to give a summary first.

WFcatamount22 said:

I believe that by today’s standards it is, and should be. Not the lying, just using the worlds most powerful position of power to pressure an intern into sexual act should be impeachable. That blurs the line of consensual sex, and the victim herself has even come forward saying as much.

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Yeah, what Clinton did was not at all acceptable and certainly blurs the lines of consent. As to whether it is impeachable, Gerald Ford said this: “An impeachable offense is whatever a majority of the House of Representatives considers it to be at a given moment in history.”

Ball State Deac said:

Yeah, what Clinton did was not at all acceptable and certainly blurs the lines of consent. As to whether it is impeachable, Gerald Ford said this: “An impeachable offense is whatever a majority of the House of Representatives considers it to be at a given moment in history.”

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Super glad we’ve devolved as a society to where we apparently don’t consider sexual assault to be an impeachable offense...

AsesinoDeTortugas said:

Super glad we’ve devolved as a society to where we apparently don’t consider sexual assault to be an impeachable offense...

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Huh?

My point is that anything is impeachable, so long as a majority of members of congress think it is. They essentially define what a "high crime and misdemeanor" is.

Ball State Deac said:

Huh?

My point is that anything is impeachable, so long as a majority of members of congress think it is. They essentially define what a "high crime and misdemeanor" is.

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I was just making a general statement based on the Ford quote, not at you specifically. Sorry if it came off as such.