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Wellman

thatguy2016 said:
I'm talking about Women's cross country.

In this thread, you said they got 8th last year, and that finish was their best in 13 years.
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so, they've never finished higher than 5th in 13 years. that's "excelling"?

has either program (men's or women's) made an NCAA finals appearance in the last 10 years?
 
thatguy2016 said:
I'm talking about Women's cross country.

In this thread, you said this fall's finish was the program's best in 13 years.

this fall, they finished 8th.
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They finished eighth in the *region* ya doofus.

wakephan09 said:
Women's xc had their best finish in 13 years.

Men's xc had their best finish in 17 years.
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This is what I wrote. I didn't mention the conference tournament at all because that had nothing to do with an NCAA bid, the thing which you imply are the indicator of excellence in this post:

thatguy2016 said:
Yes. Women finished 8th. No NCAA bid. Is that “excelling”?

Men finished 5th. No NCAA bid. Is that “excelling”?
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Your confusion about the difference between the conference meet and the regional meet is understandable. If you're struggling with "this year" and "last year" I'm not sure I can help you.
 
wakephan09 said:
Stop RJing this up. Go back and read the posts carefully. It's not that difficult.
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I'm saying that the men's and women's cross country teams, among several other WF athletic teams are not "excelling" as was posited

you are not offering sufficient evidence to refute my claim

we can discuss either NCAA regionals performance or ACC championship performance - in either case, the WF teams are not "excelling"
 
BirdinBama said:
He truly is a pompous prick.
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I can attest to this in my experience in Wake Athletics as an undergrad in a minor sport. I had one or two interactions with Wellman and I remember thinking even at the tender age of twenty that he was very arrogant. I'm sure that's only gotten worse in the ten years since I've graduated.
 
Ok, fine. We can agree on that much.

My point is that just using "NCAA bids" as an indicator of excellence in Cross Country or Track and Field is reductive.

We're not finishing top 3 in the country like we did in the early 90s, so we're probably not "historically competitive". But I think we've got a solid coaching staff and both programs are moving in the right direction. Men finishing fifth in the ACC with an individual as runner up is pretty fucking good.

When I was in school not that many years ago we had several individual national champions and several Olympians. Since wake can count those on a couple of hands I'd say that's pretty excellent. And we've got a better coaching staff now.
 
ironwill24 said:
I can attest to this in my experience in Wake Athletics as an undergrad in a minor sport. I had one or two interactions with Wellman and I remember thinking even at the tender age of twenty that he was very arrogant. I'm sure that's only gotten worse in the ten years since I've graduated.
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I really have no problem with someone being arrogant, if they have earned it. There is nothing worse than incompetence mixed with arrogance. Looks like Wellman found like minds with his last two basketball hires.
 
wakephan09 said:
Ok, fine. We can agree on that much.

My point is that just using "NCAA bids" as an indicator of excellence in Cross Country or Track and Field is reductive.

We're not finishing top 3 in the country like we did in the early 90s, so we're probably not "historically competitive". But I think we've got a solid coaching staff and both programs are moving in the right direction. Men finishing fifth in the ACC with an individual as runner up is pretty fucking good.

When I was in school not that many years ago we had several individual national champions and several Olympians. Since wake can count those on a couple of hands I'd say that's pretty excellent. And we've got a better coaching staff now.
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so you agree with my original statement

cool

glad you got to start a semantics argument anyway
 
thatguy2016 said:
so you agree with my original statement

cool

glad you got to start a semantics argument anyway
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More or less.

And this argument wasn't about semantics at all. It was about you using incorrect facts to make a reasonable argument. Just wanted to set the record straight because I care.
 
wakephan09 said:
More or less.

And this argument wasn't about semantics at all. It was about you using incorrect facts to make a reasonable argument. Just wanted to set the record straight because I care.
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I care too. Just not about this.
 
knowell said:
I care too. Just not about this.
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Well thatguy's point was about (lack of) success in the Olympic Sports, so it was not a total digression.

Totally fair for people not to give a shit about Olympic sports. Or, more likely, to think they shouldn't matter when assessing the success of an Athletic Director. But they're important to me so I'll argue for them
 
PhDeac said:
Fair or not, ADs are judged by football and men’s basketball and depending on your situation women’s basketball and baseball. We are decent in two and horrible in two.
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Personally I think it all comes down to mens basketball and football as these are the only sports that make money. Right now I'd say Wellman has done well with football but completely screwed the pooch in basketball to a degree that the hiring if clawson doesn't forgive.
 
knowell said:
I really have no problem with someone being arrogant, if they have earned it. There is nothing worse than incompetence mixed with arrogance. Looks like Wellman found like minds with his last two basketball hires.
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This is very true. I should have expounded... His arrogance made him seem incompetent in my interaction with him. Don't want to go into details really but he seemed like he didn't really give a fuck about something he should have given a fuck about as AD
 
El Chupacabra said:
Just to echo what a lot of others have said: He is arrogant and VERY conservative (politically and socially, too, but not the point, though that has caused some clashes with coaches and some AD personnel). He has basically lucked into a couple of these high profile big donors (Flow, Sutton, Shah, McCreary), as he is not a dynamic personality nor a particularly gifted fundraiser, and has enough people on the board who have his back (though there has been some rustling lately). Basically what it looks like and what a lot of people have already said. Some of the board may also have reason not to particularly care about our athletic success, specifically in hoops — nothing nefarious, just some mixed loyalties — and he runs a clean department and keeps it solvent.

Some of these big guys would need to start making a lot of noise for any forced change, and I think most are content with just riding it out.
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I need to hear more about these board members with “mixed loyalties” regarding the success of our banner sport. Seems noteworthy.
 
knowell said:
I really have no problem with someone being arrogant, if they have earned it. There is nothing worse than incompetence mixed with arrogance. Looks like Wellman found like minds with his last two basketball hires.
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Yep. I have hung out with Wellman a few times. He is very arrogant. Too much to realize his own incompetence.
 
I have heard that when Wellman took over, he marched into WSJS ( who had broadcast Wake forver) and demanded that the radio station broadcast all women's basketball games and all Wake baseball games live, or he was going to end the relationship. He was asked to leave
Arrogant, yep.
 
SC DEAC said:
Since the moment that skip died, well man has screwed up every single basketball decision he has made. Every one.
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Do not worry my dear SC Deac because lots of rumors abound around the Atlantic Coast Conference that the 70 year old Well-Man, he of the blackest dye job around has told many people of his plans to retire at the end of this academic year. One can only hope that he makes that decision much quicker so he is not the one to make any decision on a new basketball coach.
 
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