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Great John Collins Article

It wouldn’t have shocked me. The certainty was that Manning would underperform. Making the tourney was certainly more likely than not, but not a certainty by any means.

Y’all have put yourselves in a logical pickle on this one.

If John Collins gets all the credit for year 3, then it’s hard to argue that if he returns in year 4, presumably an even better basketball player, that the team will somehow get worse.

So either Manning did something right in year 3 that you think he couldn’t replicate in year 4, or we likely would have been a tournament team in year 4 again if everyone came back.

No logical pickle at all. Team performances, especially with a mediocre or worse coaching, can fluctuate. Look at Clemson this year. You have seemed to place all of your consideration of manning into one year when we wouldn't have sniffed the tournament without a comeback against UL. Considering Manning's record in close games, is it wise to assume that this was a repeatable phenomena. You also thought that Manning wouldn't devolve the program into a dumpster fire either 2 years later and he has. So maybe you are overestimating Manning's coaching ability perhaps?
 
It wouldn’t have shocked me. The certainty was that Manning would underperform. Making the tourney was certainly more likely than not, but not a certainty by any means.

Y’all have put yourselves in a logical pickle on this one.

If John Collins gets all the credit for year 3, then it’s hard to argue that if he returns in year 4, presumably an even better basketball player, that the team will somehow get worse.

So either Manning did something right in year 3 that you think he couldn’t replicate in year 4, or we likely would have been a tournament team in year 4 again if everyone came back.

We were in the play in game dude. A couple of bounces the wrong way and we would have not made the last four. Yeah, definitely a shoe in for the tourney the next year....
 
Collins bled last night. Carry on e pointless bickering. Just wasted 3 minutes while taking a dump skimming this pointlessness
 
No logical pickle at all. Team performances, especially with a mediocre or worse coaching, can fluctuate. Look at Clemson this year. You have seemed to place all of your consideration of manning into one year when we wouldn't have sniffed the tournament without a comeback against UL. Considering Manning's record in close games, is it wise to assume that this was a repeatable phenomena. You also thought that Manning wouldn't devolve the program into a dumpster fire either 2 years later and he has. So maybe you are overestimating Manning's coaching ability perhaps?

I doubt you’ll find a lot of examples of teams with players as good as JC was his sophomore year that return everyone, stay healthy, add a top 50 player, and yet get worse the following year. Maybe it happens more often than I think.
 
We were in the play in game dude. A couple of bounces the wrong way and we would have not made the last four. Yeah, definitely a shoe in for the tourney the next year....

A couple of bounces the right way and we are an 8 seed. And who said shoe-in?

Let’s look at it another way. In your opinion, how many net points per game was John Collins worth his sophomore year?
 
I doubt you’ll find a lot of examples of teams with players as good as JC was his sophomore year that return everyone, stay healthy, add a top 50 player, and yet get worse the following year. Maybe it happens more often than I think.

you think Chaundee is a top 50 player? or you just ignore reality. manning is such a bad coach it is very possible we would have been worse even with collins back. the defense has gotten worse every single year, and that was not one of collins strong points.
 
It's hilarious how someone can believe we'd be better with more Collins while also believing playing him 14 and 26 min/game his two years was enough.
 
you think Chaundee is a top 50 player? or you just ignore reality. manning is such a bad coach it is very possible we would have been worse even with collins back. the defense has gotten worse every single year, and that was not one of collins strong points.

He was a top 50 recruit. If you put him on the team instead of Arians and factor in just Collins progression it’s hard to seriously argue we would have been worse than 16-17.

How many points per game do you think Collins was worth his sophomore year?
 
There’s a search function if you think I’ve ever said Manning played Collins the correct amount of minutes.

When discussing that Collins played too few minutes...

On paper, last year’s team was less talented than any team [name redacted] ever coached at Wake. Manning won 19 games, went to the NCAA tournament, and finished as a top 40 team.

Maybe we should stop second guessing how he chose to develop his three star recruit into one of the best 50 big men in the world and just be thankful that he did. It’s the only relevant thing to happen to Wake basketball this decade.
 
When discussing that Collins played too few minutes...

I’m pretty sure that was a discussion on how Collins’ minutes his freshman year impacted his development. And nowhere in that post do I argue that Collins played the correct amount either year. My point was that not playing enough his freshman year didn’t stunt his growth as some were claiming.

Keep looking.
 
Just gonna put this here.

 
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That 360 alley oop though. Collins giving away previews of tomorrow night.
 
Great article. Didn’t know he was a great swimmer too.

Crazy how Collins is always criminally underrated. Last night, the TNT discussed which players were future all stars and they didn’t mention Collins even though he’s averaging 19/9 with great percentages.
 
Collins got robbed on his first dunk. Basically mathematically eliminated although Bridges missing helps.
 
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