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Grobe or Clawson, who ya got?

Seemed like Grobe lost his edge when he stopped talking about blowing snot bubbles and bowing your neck back and wearing that ratty sweatshirt on the sideline at games.
 
Would obviously never have happened at the time, but if Grobe takes the Arkansas job and we hire Clawson back then, are we the Stanford (or even better) of the ACC at this point? Clawson has gotten Wake to this point from probably the worst P5 offensive roster ever assembled. Give him Riley Skinner and co (and Rug as OC) with his recruiting work ethic and we'd have a couple more ACC 'ships by now!
 
Clawson would have been a plausible hire in 2007. He won the CAA at Richmond and lost in the FCS semis.
 
tigerswood said:
Would obviously never have happened at the time, but if Grobe takes the Arkansas job and we hire Clawson back then, are we the Stanford (or even better) of the ACC at this point? Clawson has gotten Wake to this point from probably the worst P5 offensive roster ever assembled. Give him Riley Skinner and co (and Rug as OC) with his recruiting work ethic and we'd have a couple more ACC 'ships by now!
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No, we will not become Stanford in football. We don't have the stadium, revenues or fan base. Without those, we won't be on their level. A Wake coach could hit the lottery with a recruiting class or two and compete, but we can't do it on a continuing basis.
 
RJKarl said:
No, we will not become Stanford in football. We don't have the stadium, revenues or fan base. Without those, we won't be on their level. A Wake coach could hit the lottery with a recruiting class or two and compete, but we can't do it on a continuing basis.
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Grobe sorta hit the recruiting lottery with the "fresh Deacs" class, a bunch of them from Pahokee,FL. That was an amazing bunch of players who significantly out played their recruiting rankings. Curry and 'Phonse were two, but there were many right behind them.
 
bcobbdeacs said:
Seemed like Grobe lost his edge when he stopped talking about blowing snot bubbles and bowing your neck back and wearing that ratty sweatshirt on the sideline at games.
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Grobe lost his edge when 1)John Bunting cried too much about our cut-blocking and Grobe actually listened; and 2)his buddy Skip dropped dead in his office

I never understood #1 but I definitely can #2

seems like the majority here are punishing Grobe for the portion of his WF career that Clawson hasn't lived through yet - from all appearances Clawson seems capable and willing to stay here and build/sustain even while his assistants get poached, but he needs to do it
 
But to be Stanford, we'd have to do it every year. Plus, they have such deep inroads into recruiting they can miss on a few each year. We can't.
 
thatguy2016 said:
Grobe lost his edge when 1)John Bunting cried too much about our cut-blocking and Grobe actually listened; and 2)his buddy Skip dropped dead in his office

I never understood #1 but I definitely can #2

seems like the majority here are punishing Grobe for the portion of his WF career that Clawson hasn't lived through yet - from all appearances Clawson seems capable and willing to stay here and build/sustain even while his assistants get poached, but he needs to do it
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I suspect that Skip's death had more of an impact on Jim Grobe than we will ever know. Even he may not have realized how much impact it had at the time. That took some of the fire out of him.

Then his good assistants departed and he did the easier thing and promoted from within. Admirable but that doesn't always get the best candidate.
 
Stanford was well under .500 post Bill Walsh until Harbs/Shaw. While they have some structural advantages to Wake, it’s still all about getting the right coach. I have complete confidence in Clawson.
 
Clawson has not had a stellar track record in picking assistants. But he has been willing to replace people who don't meet his standards. Scheier and now Sawvel are two.
 
Deaconblue said:
Clawson has not had a stellar track record in picking assistants. But he has been willing to replace people who don't meet his standards. Scheier and now Sawvel are two.
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Whaattttt???? You do know Dave brought on Mike Elko who is the most sought after DC in years in NCAA football??? Sawvel appeared to be a great hire based on what he did @ Minnesota, but clearly didn't pan out and then Claw made the move to cut him and give the reins to Hemphill/Cohen which has turned out tremendously in our last 4-5 games of the season. And recently hired Santucci who was an Elko disciple and appears to be a great hire.

So not buying Dave doesn't have a stellar track record picking assistants. Not even mentioning his bringing Ruggiero which appeared questionable early but seems to be looking great the last couple of years.
 
SDeacz said:
I didn't say anyone is complaining about Grobe's first 5 years. I'm making a point that his first 8, he changed this program, into winning an ACC ship, and got to the point where fans were disappointed at an 8-5 finish and winning a bowl game. His bad 3 years at the end do not sum up his coaching career, and those last three years seem to be the determining factor when deciding whether he was a better coach or worse coach than Clawson. Sometimes you are just unlucky. Sometimes the stuff you've done to have great success doesn't work anymore. He didn't adapt. He didn't fire guys he was loyal to. He valued relationships over results. That let him down. He was fired. A coach who brought wake 5 of it's 10 bowl games in history and second ACC championship ever was fired for not making those changes, and it was probably the right move, especially considering Clawson's early success. I'm just not ready to say Clawson has done more for wake or is a better coach at this juncture, and it appears I have a minority opinion.

Grobe did have some talent when he came in. Caldwell went 2-9 with that same talent. Coaching has something to do with it, probably moreso than guys being 21 instead of 20 years old.
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this is a really good post; also like the comparison of 2011 (5-3 in conference, beat a ranked FSU, had a 4th quarter lead at #9 Clemson with the ACC Atlantic on the line, earned a pretty decent bowl trip) to 2018
 
saltydeac said:
Whaattttt???? You do know Dave brought on Mike Elko who is the most sought after DC in years in NCAA football??? Sawvel appeared to be a great hire based on what he did @ Minnesota, but clearly didn't pan out and then Claw made the move to cut him and give the reins to Hemphill/Cohen which has turned out tremendously in our last 4-5 games of the season. And recently hired Santucci who was an Elko disciple and appears to be a great hire.

So not buying Dave doesn't have a stellar track record picking assistants. Not even mentioning his bringing Ruggiero which appeared questionable early but seems to be looking great the last couple of years.
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We don’t really know anything predictive about Santucci. I hope he’s awesome, but his resume isn’t that impressive. I still trust DC to make an informed and intentional decision about what’s best.
 
saltydeac said:
Whaattttt???? You do know Dave brought on Mike Elko who is the most sought after DC in years in NCAA football??? Sawvel appeared to be a great hire based on what he did @ Minnesota, but clearly didn't pan out and then Claw made the move to cut him and give the reins to Hemphill/Cohen which has turned out tremendously in our last 4-5 games of the season. And recently hired Santucci who was an Elko disciple and appears to be a great hire.

So not buying Dave doesn't have a stellar track record picking assistants. Not even mentioning his bringing Ruggiero which appeared questionable early but seems to be looking great the last couple of years.
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Clawson has hired six coordinators at Wake.

Elko - Outstanding
Sawvel - Fired midseason
Ruggerio - Pretty Good
Schier - Released after three seasons
Lineburg - Doing OK so far.
Hemphill - Too soon to tell, but looking good.

So Clawson has hired six coordinators in his five years at Wake. Two he fired. One moved on to much bigger and better positions.

A stellar track record in my mind doesn't include firing 1/3 because of performance or other issues.
 
Deaconblue said:
Clawson has hired six coordinators at Wake.

Elko - Outstanding
Sawvel - Fired midseason
Ruggerio - Pretty Good
Schier - Released after three seasons
Lineburg - Doing OK so far.
Hemphill - Too soon to tell, but looking good.

So Clawson has hired six coordinators in his five years at Wake. Two he fired. One moved on to much bigger and better positions.

A stellar track record in my mind doesn't include firing 1/3 because of performance or other issues.
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But you should give him credit for firing them.
 
Clawson needs to average 9 wins and 6 conference wins a year for the next three years in order to surpass Grobe through 8 seasons. Until he does either of those things once, this thread is stupid.
 
Deacfreak07 said:
:squint:
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That’s not a knock on Clawson btw. I’m just honestly shocked this thread went 8 pages. I’m ambivalent as to how LOWF we should judge Wake football, but I do believe we should be consistent.

If we are the type of school that gets excited about our football coach when he makes the college football equivalent of the CBI/NIT three years in a row, we don’t also get to be a school that thinks a few historically competitive years outweighs the best three year stretch our program has ever seen.
 
RChildress107 said:
Clawson needs to average 9 wins and 6 conference wins a year for the next three years in order to surpass Grobe through 8 seasons. Until he does either of those things once, this thread is stupid.
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Does the term "context" ring a bell?
 
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