RChildress107
Well-known member
I’m not. I think you’re wrong.
“Cages for humans are humane!” is more the Junebug I know.
I’m not. I think you’re wrong.
We (the royal we) are fighting for liberation. That includes people inside, call them people not convicts, and activists on the outside. Millions of people live in that unjust system. It is not incumbent on incarcerated people, or the activists who share a common goal, to finalize concrete plans for what is next, BEFORE demanding liberation.
We (the royal we) are fighting for liberation. That includes people inside, call them people not convicts, and activists on the outside. Millions of people live in that unjust system. It is not incumbent on incarcerated people, or the activists who share a common goal, to finalize concrete plans for what is next, BEFORE demanding liberation.
we're not asking convicts to solve problems. we're asking college educated instigators to solve the problem they are saying exists on this message board thread they created
If you're serious about what you're asking for - it really is. Maybe not finalizing, but proposing something concrete in the alternative is necessary in my view. You're saying the reforms proposed by like-minded people don't go far enough. You want to do away with the system altogether. But you have no framework for what comes next. What does anybody do with that? Nothing.
We (the royal we) are fighting for liberation. That includes people inside, call them people not convicts, and activists on the outside. Millions of people live in that unjust system. It is not incumbent on incarcerated people, or the activists who share a common goal, to finalize concrete plans for what is next, BEFORE demanding liberation.
If you're serious about what you're asking for - it really is. Maybe not finalizing, but proposing something concrete in the alternative is necessary in my view. You're saying the reforms proposed by like-minded people don't go far enough. You want to do away with the system altogether. But you have no framework for what comes next. What does anybody do with that? Nothing.
I thought it was immoral to lock people up?
Sounds to me like this is just a line-drawing debate.
That's bullshit for "I have no fucking clue" or "You're really going to hate the plan".
ADT I agree with pretty much all your reforms because you are talking as a reformist not a destroyer idealist. The inability to get employment is certainly a massive reason for the repeat offender system we have now. If you committed a crime that directly deals with the employment type you seek then it’s understandable that this should be reported, I.e financial crimes and banking, child crimes and children, but no reason your criminal record should be used to prevent hiring of a restaurant cook or the like.
You’re not this dumb.
No it's not. And as I said, I don't mind talking about plans and alternatives. We should absolutely discuss them and plan for alternatives. I will when I have more time. My point is still that the oppressed do not have to define the terms of their freedom before demanding freedom.
Yeah, sure. They can demand until they are blue in the face. But in order to get their demands they have to define how their freedom looks.
Abolitionist are calling into question the ability of our PIC to reform to meet these goals, given that past reforms have gotten us to this point. You can't just say "we need to hire people out of jail" without wrestling with the facts that the entire machine of the PIC prevents people from those jobs and profits off their labor.
If I'm being honest, I don't think ADT has proposed any reforms that are capable of even making a tiny dent in our problem of mass incarceration.