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Another racist democrat

TenaciousKory said:
were the British involved in Palestine in the 19th c?

not sure of the history of Zionism as recolonization

MDMH why are you so affected by the political struggle in Gaza/West Bank? just a general injustice deal? EDIT: gotcha.
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I didn't realize 19th century englishmen only discussed imperialism when it was their own colony
 
ImTheCaptain said:
I didn't realize 19th century englishmen only discussed imperialism when it was their own colony
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ask a historical question get a oddly edgy response

very cool

thanks sailor - i guess i'm interested in how GB viewed Palestine specifically in the 19th c - or was Mandate something that kind of fell out of WWI
 
sailordeac said:
Theodore Herzl, a journalist and writer in Vienna, developed the modern political doctrine of Zionism during the 1890s
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yeah someone sent me a history of the Zionist movement last year - a lot of stuff was new to me.
 
TenaciousKory said:
were the British involved in Palestine in the 19th c?

not sure of the history of Zionism as recolonization

MDMH why are you so affected by the political struggle in Gaza/West Bank? just a general injustice deal?
Click to expand...
I didn't really know anything about Palestine until 2005 when I became really good friends with a Palestinian student at Pitt CC and met his family. I actually sat in his living room with his whole family when they returned from an attempted trip to Gaza (through Israel with travel permits) to visit their relatives and that's how I first learned about it. Their week-long trip was 2 days detained in the airport and then they were sent right back on seperate flights.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
After a years long letter campaign, for one special day I was named by parliament as a celebratory envoy to Palestine, for the express purpose of cursing at Lectro. Now you know.

Regarding your "red flags" - calling an entire political party anti-semitic for their political criticisms of a foreign state and that states political influence on their own country, is not "raising red flags". The inability and unwillingness of certain people, gentile and Jew alike, to differentiate between the political state of Israel and the religion of Judiasm, is nearly the entire problem. 25% of Israelites aren't Jewish. Benjamin Netanyahu and the Likud party are not religious figureheads. The Torah does not call for Palestinians to be held prisoner on their own land.

I provided a direct public source from the Labour Friends of Israel, the group to which the Labour defectors belong, where they refer to "anti-zionism" as "anti-semitic". In terms of religious tolerance and foreign policy, Zionism is radical and Islamaphobic.
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Macron disagrees. https://www.france24.com/en/2019022...-semitism-france-crif-definition-anti-zionism
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
I didn't really know anything about Palestine until 2005 when I became really good friends with a Palestinian student at Pitt CC and met his family. I actually sat in his living room with his whole family when they returned from an attempted trip to Gaza (through Israel with travel permits) to visit their relatives and that's how I first learned about it. Their week-long trip was 2 days detained in the airport and then they were sent right back on seperate flights.
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So they never actually got to leave the airport?
 
TenaciousKory said:
ask a historical question get a oddly edgy response

very cool

thanks sailor - i guess i'm interested in how GB viewed Palestine specifically in the 19th c - or was Mandate something that kind of fell out of WWI
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once the Suez canal was built by the French, the British wanted to get it, and in the mid 1870s they did by secretly buying up the shares of the ruler of Egypt (PM Disraeli acting in secret with the help of the Rothchild bank); the French were pissed but soon the British were penetrating into Egypt under the guise of preserving order, guaranteeing financial stability, and of course protecting their Suez canal, a vital shortcut to India, the Crown Jewel of the British Empire; naturally they would have been interested in any of the nearby areas, such as Palestine, in order better to guard the Suez Canal (see how naturally and easily one can justify the expansion of an empire); they soon struck a deal with the Ottoman Empire in which they offered to guarantee the non-European territories of the Ottoman Empire in exchange for Cyprus, which they used as a naval base to protect the Suez Canal; so, in a sense they did not need Palestine anymore and until Turkey entered WWI they were actually the guarantors of continued Turkish authority over Palestine; then came Lawrence of Arabia, who by providing British support for the Arab revolt against the Turks helped to extend Britain's interest over what is today Israel and I think Jordan too, while the French also after WWI got a mandate over what is today Lebanon and Syria, these had all been under Ottoman control for centuries
 
TenaciousKory said:
So they never actually got to leave the airport?
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Nope. This was early summer of 2007 right before I left for my internship in DC. It's actually one of the last times I ever saw him, since I've only been back to Greenville like twice since then.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
Nope. This was early summer of 2007 right before I left for my internship in DC. It's actually one of the last times I ever saw him, since I've only been back to Greenville like twice since then.
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so just a general injustice deal?

(some of y’all are ridiculous)
 
Strickland33 said:
so just a general injustice deal?

(some of y’all are ridiculous)
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Yeah, I dont have any other personal connections to the topic besides my old friend, and I havent talked to him in a long time.
 
I just can’t understand the people that criticize advocates of groups or classes that are not themselves members of that group or class. I’m a straight white male that grew up in a middle to upper-middle class family and had every opportunity imaginable. I’m lucky. But does that disqualify me from advocating for or supporting the causes of the LGBTQ community? For women? For minirities?

I don’t have an educated opinion on Palestine/Israel as it hasn’t been something I’m exposed to often, but I firmly believe that setting some arbitrary bar for how much you are connected to an issue is wrong.
 
I read a book called "Freedom is a Constant Struggle" which is formatted as a dialogue with the OG, Angela Davis, and it did a great job of linking the Palestinian struggle with Ferguson and the BLM movement. During Ferguson, Palestinian activists were communicated directly with Ferguson activists on how to deal with tear gas and other police tactics. There is a direct link between the militarization of our police and the military industrial complex and Israeli occupation of Palestine. That book was one of my main influences in becoming a socialist.
 
oh

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/sep/30/flawed-reporting-on-antisemitism-claims-against-the-labour-party?CMP=share_btn_fb&fbclid=IwAR0uI8QdV-nuBv0ra5hD3YrZxkwUYgezK1DjA19eNrlLk3ejiizifIJvMxQ

The researchers conclude these were not occasional lapses in judgment but “systematic reporting failures” that served to weaken the Labour leadership and to bolster its opponents within and outside of the party.

It is of course entirely appropriate and necessary for our major news outlets to report on the horrors of antisemitism, but wrong to present it as an issue specific to the Labour party.

In covering the allegations that Labour is now “institutionally antisemitic”, there have been inaccuracies, clear distortions and revealing omissions across our most popular media platforms. We believe that significant parts of the UK media have failed their audiences by producing flawed reports that have contributed to an undeserved witch-hunt against the Labour leader and misdirected public attention away from antisemitism elsewhere, including on the far right, which is ascendant in much of Europe.
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Strickland33 said:
I mean, who cares. You care. That’s what’s important.

Kory, do you care?
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Sure, I guess. Jasbir Puar gave a talk on campus last semester theorizing how Israeli governance of Palestinians keeps them barely alive - in a state of "slow death" as a deliberate strategy of extracting value from them. I thought it was interesting. Otherwise I don't really spend much time being affected by the political climate there.
 
MHBDemon said:
I read a book called "Freedom is a Constant Struggle" which is formatted as a dialogue with the OG, Angela Davis, and it did a great job of linking the Palestinian struggle with Ferguson and the BLM movement. During Ferguson, Palestinian activists were communicated directly with Ferguson activists on how to deal with tear gas and other police tactics. There is a direct link between the militarization of our police and the military industrial complex and Israeli occupation of Palestine. That book was one of my main influences in becoming a socialist.
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Yeaaa,Bob called and said he’s gonna need come in this weekend.
 
TenaciousKory said:
Sure, I guess. Jasbir Puar gave a talk on campus last semester theorizing how Israeli governance of Palestinians keeps them barely alive - in a state of "slow death" as a deliberate strategy of extracting value from them. I thought it was interesting. Otherwise I don't really spend much time being affected by the political climate there.
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that must be nice
 
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