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Institutional Malpractice

Skip was a great educator, regular season coach and did a phenomenal job of getting students involved and generating fan interest, but he wasn't the home run hire some are saying. Turns out the home run hire at that time would have been Beilein.
 
Some posters appear comfortable with Wellman making the next hire; my apologies for mistaking you as one of them.

No one is ignoring what Wellman has done re: facilities, football, and non-revenue sports. We are just putting those accomplishments into proper context.

Facilities: Wellman has merely kept up with the Joneses, and belatedly so. However, that in and of itself is an accomplishment at Wake given some of the institutional challenges so I’ll give him a B+ in that regard.

Soccer: Hard to know how much credit Wellman deserves here. He did what 99% of AD’s would do in 1994 and promoted Vidovich who then went on to build the program to what it is now. He nailed the Muus hire, but that feels like low hanging fruit. It’s also soccer. He gets an A but this was a pretty easy course.

Olympic Sports: I don’t care enough to look it up but my guess is that over his tenure we’ve been about middle of the pack in the ACC in this regard, especially if you exclude soccer. This one is pass/fail and he gets a pass.

Football: If you are going to claim that in the current NCAA environment football is most important, then our program should be judged against that environment, not our own lackluster history. In that regard, it’s hard to give Wellman higher than a C+. Clawson’s progress stalled a little last year and at any P5 school even semi-serious about football his seat would be getting lukewarm.

Basketball: F-

If he had As on everything else then maybe we could talk about whether that balances out his utter failure with the basketball program, but he doesn’t. He should have been fired the day after the Manning hire at the very latest.

Seems we are essentially on the same page then. I'd give him a higher grade for football, but that is more because I think the Clawson hire and facility upgrades as well as stadium upgrades have collectively saved us from really falling off the cliff after Jim Grobe grew tired of fighting Clemson and Florida State.

I know I keep harping on it, but I really do think Wellman has shat the bed in getting the Asheville to Charlotte to Greensboro crowd bought into coming to BB&T field six or seven Saturdays from late summer through Fall. The perception of Wake has always been an elitist institution that sort of turns their back on Winston-Salem for the most part. Wellman has only made that worse. You need more of those people to see the proximity to BB&T and the Joel and Spry as an opportunity - like living in New York and being an hour subway ride from the Natural History Museum, Guggenheim, etc... I hope we at least consider that in our next AD hire and bring in someone with some sort of community relations background or commitment. It makes such a difference in creating a home court/field advantage and retaining coaches IMO.
 
Skip was a great educator, regular season coach and did a phenomenal job of getting students involved and generating fan interest, but he wasn't the home run hire some are saying. Turns out the home run hire at that time would have been Beilein.

Skip was capable of recruiting a team that could win the national championship without a hurricane destroying some teanager's local swimming pool. We haven't had anybody like that since.
 
Skip was capable of recruiting a team that could win the national championship without a hurricane destroying some teanager's local swimming pool. We haven't had anybody like that since.

Possibly, but he wasn't capable of coaching them past the Sweet 16. I'd take that flaw in a NY minute right now.
 
Possibly, but he wasn't capable of coaching them past the Sweet 16. I'd take that flaw in a NY minute right now.

Well, he only had one season with a true Final Four caliber team, so it's a small sample size.
 
Skip was a great educator, regular season coach and did a phenomenal job of getting students involved and generating fan interest, but he wasn't the home run hire some are saying. Turns out the home run hire at that time would have been Beilein.


Skip has a lot left to prove, but citing Beilein as the clearly better alternative seems weird.
 
Off the top of my head I can think of two NCAA finals appearances and two regional finals that were very close losses for Beilein since Wake hired Skip. That's clearly better.
 
Off the top of my head I can think of two NCAA finals appearances and two regional finals that were very close losses for Beilein since Wake hired Skip. That's clearly better.

Only one of those regional finals was before Skip’s death and it was the result of a head to head victory over Skip in double OT.

We obviously don’t know if Skip would have accomplished the same things Beilein did, but that’s kind of the point.
 
If I recall correctly, Skip's teams didn't play a lot of defense either. We just had superior fire power to outscore the other team.
 
It seems like we underperform regardless of coach. The 2002 and 2004 teams were the only ones in recent memory that seemed to hold their own when they barely lost to higher seeds. The 2003 and 2005 teams underperformed as two seeds. That carried over to the 2009 team with the first round blowout to the hands of Cleveland State.
 
It seems like we underperform regardless of coach. The 2002 and 2004 teams were the only ones in recent memory that seemed to hold their own when they barely lost to higher seeds. The 2003 and 2005 teams underperformed as two seeds. That carried over to the 2009 team with the first round blowout to the hands of Cleveland State.

Wake has had Final Four caliber teams in 1977, 1981, 1984, 1995-1997, 2005, 2009
 
Yeah. There was a sense of dread going into the 2009 tournament. I was pissed we had the last game of the first round. It delayed the inevitable.
 
The 09 team collapsed down the stretch. Even though Andy Katz picked us as a sleeper for the Final Four that year, we all had to know we wouldn't go far. Teague checked out prior to the ACCT
 
Skip was a great educator, regular season coach and did a phenomenal job of getting students involved and generating fan interest, but he wasn't the home run hire some are saying. Turns out the home run hire at that time would have been Beilein.

He certainly had flaws as a coach but I would call Skip a home-run for Wake Forest. The fit between Skip and Wake Forest was a rare thing - and something not likely to be found again. His teams played exciting basketball. He recruited great players and seemed to inspire them - just listen to them talk about him even today. He had some down years where he missed on the talent, for sure. But I think he would have had us more than competitive most of the time. Making a final 4 or winning a title take luck as well as talent - some teams and coaches need more luck than others - Wake could never seem to get any at all. Given a few more years with high-end talent I think he would have gotten us there eventually.
 
That’s a fair take. Then you remember that Xavier hoops took off after he left and outpaced Wake while Skip was our coach.
 
To only make one sweet 16 and get to no ACC finals with the teams skip had was underachieving in the postseason pretty significantly
 
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