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Leverage in negotiating $18 million buyout

Anybody who still didn't have serious concerns about Manning's coaching ability even after that first four year was crazy. Wellman has been doubling down trying to save face from his stupid decisions regarding Dino and [Redacted] and has subjected us to the decade of misery that some of us predicted being a real possibility the day the [Redacted] hiring was announced
 
jaybone said:
Not following. Can't tell if you are agreeing or disagreeing w me.

We are all guessing. I am guessing 18mil is not real because it doesn't make logical sense. It is more than the length of the contract. Much more
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I clarified with an edit before I realized you'd responded. We know nothing about the $18M number. Goodman is the only person with a source on this. Your speculation is inherently less informed than his.

And you're literally making up stuff about Manning's salary. We have no idea what his salary is right now. Nor do we know how it scales over time. Manning's extension and guarantee very well could have been worth $18 million without bonuses. We don't know, and won't know much for years until the 990's are released showing multiple years of his salary under the extension.
 
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I have read on here from a number of sourced posters that the $18 mil is super high and that the number is "closer to $10mil" For that discrepancy to be truth, then the contract has to be incentivized. Since every coaching contract known to man is incentivized, it makes sense that Manning's would be too.

Additionally, it was also tweeted when VTech signed Mike Young that his salary was $2mil which placed him just above Danny Manning, who was at $1,830,360. That seemed specific enough to me to be accurate. Through 2024-25. Multiply that by 6 years and you get about $11mil, which is the number we are from sourced posters.

Goodman's number only makes sense if Manning's contract is incentivized. The only other logical explanation is that Manning's agent was able to figure out that Manning's first year on his new contract was going to suck and threw in a big number if fired after Year 1. That would be good-ish news for us in that when Manning is fired next Spring, he'll get $9mil at most.

I just haven't found any confirmation anywhere that Goodman's number is even remotely accurate.
 
Well you are assuming both the $18MM number and the $10MM number are correct under some formulation of the contract . Regardless, what we know is that Manning is back. The only reason I can think of is that because we would owe him too much damn money to get rid of him.
 
jaybone said:
I have read on here from a number of sourced posters that the $18 mil is super high and that the number is "closer to $10mil" For that discrepancy to be truth, then the contract has to be incentivized. Since every coaching contract known to man is incentivized, it makes sense that Manning's would be too.

Additionally, it was also tweeted when VTech signed Mike Young that his salary was $2mil which placed him just above Danny Manning, who was at $1,830,360. That seemed specific enough to me to be accurate. Through 2024-25. Multiply that by 6 years and you get about $11mil, which is the number we are from sourced posters.

Goodman's number only makes sense if Manning's contract is incentivized. The only other logical explanation is that Manning's agent was able to figure out that Manning's first year on his new contract was going to suck and threw in a big number if fired after Year 1. That would be good-ish news for us in that when Manning is fired next Spring, he'll get $9mil at most.

I just haven't found any confirmation anywhere that Goodman's number is even remotely accurate.
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The $1,830,360 is the number on the 6/30/17 Form 990 (Claws got the same salary that fiscal year). https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/560532138/201811349349300206/IRS990 That's before the new contract kicked in. It's reasonable to think he's getting closer to $3,000,000 now. The $18m is simply six years at $3m guaranteed.
 
jaybone said:
Additionally, it was also tweeted when VTech signed Mike Young that his salary was $2mil which placed him just above Danny Manning, who was at $1,830,360. That seemed specific enough to me to be accurate. Through 2024-25. Multiply that by 6 years and you get about $11mil, which is the number we are from sourced posters.
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Danny Manning's contract has been discussed in detail. That number is from the most recently released 2017 990 that represents the Fiscal year ending in June of that year. It does not represent anything to do with his extension nor any contracted raises that may have been a part of his original contract.
 
Atlanta Deacon said:
It's reasonable to think he's getting closer to $3,000,000 now. The $18m is simply six years at $3m guaranteed.
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And, like Young's contract that starts at $2M and goes up to $2.75 by Y5, it could easily be stepped such that he doesn't get paid $3M in Y1 of the extension.
 
I just noticed something on Guidestar, Wellman got about $1,050,000 for the 6/30/17 fiscal year but back in 2011 he got $2.4m. Bastard!
 
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Atlanta Deacon said:
The $1,830,360 is the number on the 6/30/17 Form 990 (Claws got the same salary that fiscal year). https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/560532138/201811349349300206/IRS990 That's before the new contract kicked in. It's reasonable to think he's getting closer to $3,000,000 now. The $18m is simply six years at $3m guaranteed.
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Don't think so, the 2017 number I saw was $1,748,878. The Boeheims, Breys, Keats type makes between $2.1 and $2.3. Buzz made $2.75. So $3m per year is not only absurd, it would not be approved.
 
The only leverage is to make him feel so unwanted in W-S over the next year that he wants out
 
jaybone said:
Don't think so, the 2017 number I saw was $1,748,878.
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No. There are two columns. They add up to 1,830,360. He posted the link for you. It's right there for you.

jaybone said:
The Boeheims, Breys, Keats type makes between $2.1 and $2.3. Buzz made $2.75. So $3m per year is not only absurd, it would not be approved.
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https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/

Boeheim is listed at $2.7M
Brey $2.4M
Keatts $2.7M
Buzz $3M

This stuff isn't hard to find.

None of those really matter anyway. Mack is making $4M despite accomplishing far less than Boehiem. Contracts start at different points. Times change and prices go up. Boeheim probably gets more from Nike than the newer coaches to the league, and his starting price was set years ago.

Seeing as there was no justification for extending Manning anyway, much less for 6 seasons, I see no reason why Manning's contract might not start at $2.5M and then go up from there over 6 years such that it averages out to $3M a year over the 6. He was already making $1.8M+, so a jump to $2.25-2.5M with similar jumps over the next 6 years would work out to $18. Mack's $4M contract certainly would have come up in negotiations.
 
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jaybone said:
Don't think so, the 2017 number I saw was $1,748,878. The Boeheims, Breys, Keats type makes between $2.1 and $2.3. Buzz made $2.75. So $3m per year is not only absurd, it would not be approved.
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We do not know how much Manning made in 2018 or 2017. We won't know what the extension paid until mid-to-late summer 2020, when the fiscal year 2019 form 990 will be available, which will show his calendar year 2018 compensation.

Another post on the subject:

WFU Lurker said:
USA today is wrong. The $1.3M is for calendar year 2014, when he only worked 8 months. The $1.7M-$1.8M is for 2015 and 2016. Form 990s, where they get this information, are not yet available for calendar years 2017 and 2018.
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Y1 $2.50M
Y2 $2.50M
Y3 $2.75M
Y4 $3.00M
Y5 $3.50M
Y6 $3.75M

All adds up at $18M total. Under that structure, he'd catch up to the Boehiem/Brey/Hamilton tier the first couple years of the extension and then start to move towards Brownell/Keatts/Buzz in the middle. By the end, he's still not caught up to Roy/Mack. If Wellman really believed Manning was the man, he would have assumed that revenue increases over those 6 years would more than cover those raises.
 
Atlanta Deacon said:
There's also that story circulating that Manning put some of his own money into the new facilities and that this was protection to make sure he gets to stay and get his money back.
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I sincerely hope that isn’t true. I would love for Manning to have ponied up cash to contribute to his program; every coach should at some level. But not if he was guaranteed to get it back. Makes it sound like we have no line of credit and we needed cash, so we went to make a withdrawal at the Bank of Manning ATM.
 
Wait, where the hell did that rumor come from?
 
DeacDaddy said:
I sincerely hope that isn’t true. I would love for Manning to have ponied up cash to contribute to his program; every coach should at some level. But not if he was guaranteed to get it back. Makes it sound like we have no line of credit and we needed cash, so we went to make a withdrawal at the Bank of Manning ATM.
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Why wouldn't they have announced that anyway? At least if it was at all sizeable.
 
I heard it was only $24.37, but Wellman ran out of checks and didn’t want to go to Wells for a temp check to reimburse Danny so he just retained him instead.
 
RacerDeac said:
Y1 $2.50M
Y2 $2.50M
Y3 $2.75M
Y4 $3.00M
Y5 $3.50M
Y6 $3.75M

All adds up at $18M total. Under that structure, he'd catch up to the Boehiem/Brey/Hamilton tier the first couple years of the extension and then start to move towards Brownell/Keatts/Buzz in the middle. By the end, he's still not caught up to Roy/Mack. If Wellman really believed Manning was the man, he would have assumed that revenue increases over those 6 years would more than cover those raises.
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Less likely than my guestimation imo. I just don't see any scenario in which you "lock up" a coach w no other offers long term AND at a salary greater than more desirable coaches. Short term high or long term low number but not your scenario. Wellman may be stupid but not that stupid.
 
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