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Thread: CA about to blow up NCAA?

  1. #201
    not to mention that music, art, etc. is all generally acknowledged to be a valuable part of a liberal arts education. Watching football is fun but not educational .

  2. #202
    Robert O'Kelley
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    You could easily argue that sports, particularly team sports, contribute more towards an individual's education and maturation than painting or playing the tuba ever could.

  3. #203
    Scott "Rufio" Feather
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigerswood View Post
    You could easily argue that sports, particularly team sports, contribute more towards an individual's education and maturation than painting or playing the tuba ever could.
    That's great. Offer qualifying students a platform where they can pursue athletic interests in intramural club sports activities. Get rid of the TV contracts, shoe deals, millionaire coaches and AD staff, overpriced ticket sales, and criminally corrupt governing bodies like the NCAA. Let the Universities then foster true student athletes, and leave professional sports to the professionals.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by DeacDiggler View Post
    Who was the last musician who lost his scholarship for playing a paid gig?
    Are you arguing that student-athletes should be able to play professional sports at the same time they are playing collegiate sports? That is allowed in some collegiate sports.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by WFcatamount22 View Post
    That's great. Offer qualifying students a platform where they can pursue athletic interests in intramural club sports activities. Get rid of the TV contracts, shoe deals, millionaire coaches and AD staff, overpriced ticket sales, and criminally corrupt governing bodies like the NCAA. Let the Universities then foster true student athletes, and leave professional sports to the professionals.
    OK, let's imagine that happens... In club sports, teams from different schools would compete against each other. Interest in those competitions would increase, especially in the most popular sports, and eventually tickets would be sold. Then, a company would begin broadcasting the competition. And we are right back where we started.

    Interest in the schools, and competition between the schools in popular sports, is what is driving the financial part of this equation.

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by WFcatamount22 View Post
    That's great. Offer qualifying students a platform where they can pursue athletic interests in intramural club sports activities. Get rid of the TV contracts, shoe deals, millionaire coaches and AD staff, overpriced ticket sales, and criminally corrupt governing bodies like the NCAA. Let the Universities then foster true student athletes, and leave professional sports to the professionals.
    Universities already do foster true student athletes. Thousands of them. Think about Wake (since that is the school most of us here know best) - do you think the Wake athletes are not true student athletes?

  7. #207
    Robert O'Kelley
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafi View Post
    Are you arguing that student-athletes should be able to play professional sports at the same time they are playing collegiate sports? That is allowed in some collegiate sports.
    Far too much risk of injury for the pro leagues/teams to ever allow this, even if the NCAA did.

  8. #208
    NCAA athletes already do participate in professional events in tennis, golf, swimming, track among other individual sports. They just can't accept the money that they otherwise would've won.

  9. #209
    Robert O'Kelley
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    Right, pretty sure this entire conversation revolves primarily around football. Basketball to a lesser extent, but that will much less of an issue once one and done is abolished in the next couple years.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by tigerswood View Post
    Right, pretty sure this entire conversation revolves primarily around football. Basketball to a lesser extent, but that will much less of an issue once one and done is abolished in the next couple years.
    That's a fair statement. Nobody really feels that the women's tennis team is being "exploited". But something does feel intrinsically off about watching 19 yo kids sacrifice their bodies to a violent game when the kids are not getting fairly compensated, and in many cases are not actually getting the education that is supposedly part of the deal. The coaches are getting millions, the AD and his minions are getting millions, the college president is sitting up in a luxury box watching it all happen (and getting millions) - and the kid doesn't even qualify for worker's comp when his knees are ruined for life. The kid can't transfer to another program if he's mistreated, and we've all heard about some of the shady situations where kids are forced out of programs to make room for the next big thing.

    Not coincidentally, football is the main place where one could reasonably expect a meaningful percentage of players to be able to get paid by outside parties for endorsements, appearance fees, autographs, etc. At the very least, some of them might want a paying job in the offseason. Which is why I am not arguing for all student athletes to get paid "fair market" salaries, whatever that means, but instead for them to be able to maximize their income outside the university if they want to. To go back a few posts, kids on music, art, academic, or any other scholarship are completely free to make money outside of college - whether in their chosen field or not. Athletes cannot, even non-revenue athletes, without causing impermissible benefit problems with the NCAA. How is that fair?

    I also think it is ridiculous that a kid can't hire an agent - or other professional - to advise them without losing their eligibility.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by Pilchard View Post
    NCAA athletes already do participate in professional events in tennis, golf, swimming, track among other individual sports. They just can't accept the money that they otherwise would've won.
    This isn't exactly correct. In some sports they can accept winnings, up to a certain amount. For example, in tennis they can accept enough money to cover travel, and on top of that they can keep $10,000 per year.

  12. #212
    Robert O'Kelley
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deacon923 View Post
    That's a fair statement. Nobody really feels that the women's tennis team is being "exploited". But something does feel intrinsically off about watching 19 yo kids sacrifice their bodies to a violent game when the kids are not getting fairly compensated, and in many cases are not actually getting the education that is supposedly part of the deal. The coaches are getting millions, the AD and his minions are getting millions, the college president is sitting up in a luxury box watching it all happen (and getting millions) - and the kid doesn't even qualify for worker's comp when his knees are ruined for life. The kid can't transfer to another program if he's mistreated, and we've all heard about some of the shady situations where kids are forced out of programs to make room for the next big thing.

    Not coincidentally, football is the main place where one could reasonably expect a meaningful percentage of players to be able to get paid by outside parties for endorsements, appearance fees, autographs, etc. At the very least, some of them might want a paying job in the offseason. Which is why I am not arguing for all student athletes to get paid "fair market" salaries, whatever that means, but instead for them to be able to maximize their income outside the university if they want to. To go back a few posts, kids on music, art, academic, or any other scholarship are completely free to make money outside of college - whether in their chosen field or not. Athletes cannot, even non-revenue athletes, without causing impermissible benefit problems with the NCAA. How is that fair?

    I also think it is ridiculous that a kid can't hire an agent - or other professional - to advise them without losing their eligibility.
    I agree with pretty much all of this, but there's gotta be some sort of rules put in place to keep that outside income under some level of control. Otherwise, Billy Bob's Chevrolet in Tucasloosa can legally pay every Bama starter $50K a year for using their likeness on a poster out in front of the dealership. That immediately gets out, and becomes a huge recruiting tool. Then Cletus's Ford in Auburn starts paying starters $75K. You see where I'm going with this.

  13. #213
    Scott "Rufio" Feather
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigerswood View Post
    I agree with pretty much all of this, but there's gotta be some sort of rules put in place to keep that outside income under some level of control. Otherwise, Billy Bob's Chevrolet in Tucasloosa can legally pay every Bama starter $50K a year for using their likeness on a poster out in front of the dealership. That immediately gets out, and becomes a huge recruiting tool. Then Cletus's Ford in Auburn starts paying starters $75K. You see where I'm going with this.
    I see no problem with this. If schools want to use their alumni base to financially recruit players to attend a university, who cares? What harm is that really actually doing?

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Deacon923 View Post
    To go back a few posts, kids on music, art, academic, or any other scholarship are completely free to make money outside of college - whether in their chosen field or not. Athletes cannot, even non-revenue athletes, without causing impermissible benefit problems with the NCAA. How is that fair?
    This is incorrect. College athletes can have paying jobs.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by WFcatamount22 View Post
    I see no problem with this. If schools want to use their alumni base to financially recruit players to attend a university, who cares? What harm is that really actually doing?
    Agreed.
    The only argument against it is that the big schools will outpay the little schools... But newsflash, they already are.

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by WFcatamount22 View Post
    I see no problem with this. If schools want to use their alumni base to financially recruit players to attend a university, who cares? What harm is that really actually doing?
    Seriously- these guys are already putting money into the program to build facilities, pay coaches, etc. I'd prefer some of that money go to the players.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by Deacon923 View Post
    Agreed.
    The only argument against it is that the big schools will outpay the little schools... But newsflash, they already are.
    This is the same discussion we had at the beginning of this thread. Universities have no interest in managing professional athletes. 90% of schools will drop out, and the system, which works really well for 99% of the student athletes, will cease to exist. Unintended consequences - just like with Ed O’Bannon and the EA sports games.

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