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Thread: Bringing Death Penalty Back at the Federal Level After Two Decades

  1. #161
    Over 180 people on death row have been exonerated. Itís not a small number.

  2. #162
    Hey I think I found a boards poster.


  3. #163
    Ishmael Smith Junebug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TownieDeac View Post
    Guillotining was common in the public square in France until a law in 1939 brought it behind the prison wall.

    Foucault argues in Discipline and Punish convincingly that the evolution of criminal justice through reform has mostly gotten crueler and more unusual. His four stages were: torture (public), punishment (public), discipline (private), prison (private, intentionally and aggressively). Though legal scholars critique the work for focusing too heavily on political history and not enough on legal, I find most of his thesis compelling.

    In the US though the best early intentions were rehabilitation through "penitent reflection" in a penitentiary, we designed a ton of panopticon style prisons and then privatized them so quickly that we never really got reform right. The arguments I'm hearing from Junebug just seem so closely to reflect the torture side:

    "It [torture] assured the articulation of the written on the oral, the secret on the public, the procedure of investigation on the operation of the confession; it made it possible to reproduce the crime on the visible body of the criminal; in the same horror, the crime had to be manifested and annulled. It also made the body of the condemned man the place where the vengeance of the sovereign was applied, the anchoring point for a manifestation of power, an opportunity of affirming the dissymmetry of forces."

    Or to borrow a phrase we're hearing a lot lately "the cruelty is the point."
    Cruelty in punishment is explicitly prohibited by the constitution. But the constitution doesnít guarantee a pain free death.

    The stories of botched lethal injections are horrific. A much safer, more effective, and less painful death would be accomplished by guillotine.

  4. #164
    I disagree with you
    ImTheCaptain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakeforest22890 View Post
    Over 180 people on death row have been exonerated. Itís not a small number.
    in the history of the country?

  5. #165
    Ishmael Smith Junebug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeacHead View Post
    Hey I think I found a boards poster.

    Thatís hilarious and all, but juries must find facts relevant to convictions and imposition of the death penalty.

  6. #166
    Ishmael Smith Junebug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    Cruelty in punishment is explicitly prohibited by the constitution. But the constitution doesnít guarantee a pain free death.

    The stories of botched lethal injections are horrific. A much safer, more effective, and less painful death would be accomplished by guillotine.
    ETA

    https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...way-to-go.html

  7. #167
    PM a mod to cement your internet status forever RJKarl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    Thatís hilarious and all, but juries must find facts relevant to convictions and imposition of the death penalty.
    So, you'd rush the death penalty. When innocent people are executed, you wouldn't give a fuck. In your world, it's the cost of doing business.

  8. #168
    The death penalty should be unconstitutional because it is impossible to apply accurately because of institutional racism in the criminal justice system. The SCOTUS found that at one point but sadly they came back to it a few years later. Itís no surprise that the states that are the highest killers are all Southern states.

    And Junebug, the point of criminal justice should be to rehabilitate, not punish at all costs until some subjective equilibrium has been achieved.
    Birds arenít real

  9. #169
    Robert O'Kelley

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    Quote Originally Posted by Junebug View Post
    Thatís hilarious and all, but juries must find facts relevant to convictions and imposition of the death penalty.
    This is dumb and all, because the government decides whether we kill the person the jury finds guilty.

  10. #170
    Irrespective of whether you believe the state possesses the right to put someone to death, this is a situation where ideals should give way to empiricism. There is an abundance of evidence showing our system makes the death penalty too costly, too protracted of a process, and too frequently misapplied. And we shouldnít be willing to alter the system that makes it that way. Ergo, just stop doing it.

  11. #171
    Bingo, my fellow Alabamian!

  12. #172
    The criminal justice system is already fucked up by having a bunch of rubes sitting on a jury deciding the outcome. If Iím actually guilty and want to get away with it, bring on the sailors of the world. If Iím innocent I want no part of that mongoloid army deciding my fate with life or death in the equation.

  13. #173
    junebug is trolling you guys

  14. #174
    Dickie Hemric
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    no lawyer would let me on a jury, too educated

  15. #175
    PM a mod to cement your internet status forever
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milhouse View Post
    junebug is trolling you guys
    Nah. Heís a true believer.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Milhouse View Post
    junebug is trolling you guys
    Yea no. He believes what heís typing on this thread.

    And getting worked.

  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Shooshmoo View Post
    This is dumb and all, because the government decides whether we kill the person the jury finds guilty.
    Also, it's the government that requires those people to get together and find someone innocent or guilty.

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by sailordeac View Post
    no lawyer would let me on a jury, too educated
    don't be so hard on yourself, sailor

    i bet you would fit right in on juries in alabama, mississippi, or louisiana
    We're going to be good again.

  19. #179
    he is definitely trolling. nobody is that stupid.

  20. #180
    Bzzz is a fucking loser Arsene Wenger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louis Gossett Jr View Post
    The criminal justice system is already fucked up by having a bunch of rubes sitting on a jury deciding the outcome. If Iím actually guilty and want to get away with it, bring on the sailors of the world. If Iím innocent I want no part of that mongoloid army deciding my fate with life or death in the equation.
    No way. Thereís a reason almost everyone, guilty or innocent, opts for trial by jury rather than a judge. I donít want a politician in a robe deciding my fate.

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