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Thread: 1619

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  2. #2
    The series is very, very good. Sadly the people who most need to hear it will not listen to it.

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    One of the best things I've ever read.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deacon923 View Post
    The series is very, very good. Sadly the people who most need to hear it will not listen to it.
    Like this cat?


  5. #5
    This guy had an argument against a premise not raised by the NYT. Principally, the NYT never asserted that in 1619, slavery was central to the US economy. But to suggest that slavery was not central to the US economy until 1800 is just... I have no words.

    To then argue that the system of slavery came crashing down after the civil war (basically false, e.g., share cropping) and had no impact going forward on America... I just. I don't even know where to start.

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    PM a mod to cement your internet status forever RJKarl's Avatar
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    No, I wasn't there. I was out of town that weekend.

  7. #7
    Robert O'Kelley
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeacHead View Post
    Like this cat?

    I love mankind...it’s people I can’t stand!!

  8. #8
    "I was blind all the time I was learning to see".

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    It's not just Fox, but right-wingers generally have freaked out over the 1619 Project. Among the conservative worthies who have vented their outrage in recent days are Newt Gingrich, Ted Cruz, the National Review, American Greatness (bkf's favorite website), Erick Erickson of The Resurgent and frequent roundtable member on Meet the Press, the Cato Institute (right-wing think tank), Byron York, the chief political writer for the conservative Washington Examiner, Benjamin Weingarten of The Federalist, Jarrett Stepman of The Daily Signal, and many others have all unloaded on the Times and the 1619 Project. It's been called an attempt to delegitimize the Founding Fathers, undermine Trump's reelection by stirring up the racial issue, and so on.

    Among the quotes from these folk's articles and twitter feeds on the 1619 Project: It's an attempt "to delegitimize America, and further divide and demoralize its citizenry", it is "the work of opinion writers who profit from seeing things through racial lenses”, and "an obvious attempt to "reframe" America's past to fit the aims of a modern, left-wing political ideology." Erickson seems particularly upset, writing that "If the land in which the United States was founded has been tainted by racism since the 1600s and everything derived therefrom is therefore tainted, then the US is illegitimate, the constitution is illegitimate, and revolution is the answer...Once you declare the United States a racist enterprise, you light a fire that will eventually consume you too."

    A good summary of the reason conservatives are so upset about the 1619 Project (and their complaints have not hurt the popularity of the series): "For white conservatives, accepting that the United States wouldn’t exist without slavery would mean acknowledging that the Founders were not the creators of an infallible civic religion, which sets the limits on all modern claims for justice. It would mean that liberty was, in practice, as much a matter of exclusion as inclusion, and that success and prosperity owe more to centuries of exploitation than to God’s blessing of an exceptional people..But their political project depends on not even considering those possibilities. And so their response was equal parts furious and vague, a barrage of arguments that discussing this country’s history is the last thing this country needs: the Times was being divisive, or it was being nihilistic, or it was implementing a secret scheme to make Americans vote against Trump by claiming that racism was an ongoing problem.

    Mostly, they wanted to express that they were very personally angry. The fact that they took a wide-ranging examination of slavery’s lasting ills as an attack on themselves was a fairly obvious confession." Indeed.

  10. #10
    PM a mod to cement your internet status forever RJKarl's Avatar
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    The person who wrote Amazing Grace worked on slave ships before becoming an abolitionist and Anglican clergyman.

    The movie that was out about 10-15 years was really good.

    One of the purest voices in the past fifty years.


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    It’s pretty obvious that a document that started “We the people” but compromised on slavery and didn’t include voting rights for most of the people didn’t really represent “We the people.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDeac View Post
    It’s pretty obvious that a document that started “We the people” but compromised on slavery and didn’t include voting rights for most of the people didn’t really represent “We the people.”
    At the time, the meaning of “We the people...” was white male land owners, but the authors’ intent was clearly different.
    Birds are real.

  14. #14
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    Here is a brief graphic history of the slave trade.
    https://www.usatoday.com/pages/inter...ctive-graphic/

    It’s just hard to me to read all this and know there are people who think the enslavers and their descendants were the heroes and victims of the last 400 years.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by PhDeac View Post
    Here is a brief graphic history of the slave trade.
    https://www.usatoday.com/pages/inter...ctive-graphic/

    It’s just hard to me to read all this and know there are people who think the enslavers and their descendants were the heroes and victims of the last 400 years.
    That is staggering.

  16. #16
    Never Murdered My FIL
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhDeac View Post
    Here is a brief graphic history of the slave trade.
    https://www.usatoday.com/pages/inter...ctive-graphic/

    It’s just hard to me to read all this and know there are people who think the enslavers and their descendants were the heroes and victims of the last 400 years.
    Or the dumbass argument that the founders “just didn’t know better”. The “everybody was doing it” excuse. It’s ok to acknowledge people like Jefferson were shitbirds AND had some great ideas that can benefit all people today.

  17. #17
    Robert O'Kelley
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    I love mankind...it’s people I can’t stand!!

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