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2019-20 MLB Hot Stove Thread...

DaDeacs said:
Are you an umpire? The "you can't do it" expression is tired. The umps doing the world series are gonna bring in $400k+ this year, it's what they are paid to do.

If that play was never called interference, you wouldn't hear anything from either side - there would not be a complaint for the Astros, it was a bad throw and a bad stretch by Gurriel. But, it's a judgement call, it's also a bad rule.
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Whatever team has that call go against them is going to complain. Teams are going to challenge any close call in the World Series. In the 3rd inning of Game 1, the Nationals came out to challenge whether or not Michael Brantley and the 3rd base coach made contact when Brantley was rounding 3rd. Didn't affect anything about the play at all (but if replays would have showed any contact being made, Brantley would have been called out).

Just glad the call didn't affect the game.
 
Pilchard said:
The purpose of the 45 foot lane to the right of the baseline is to give the catcher or pitcher a lane to throw when the batter hits dribbler in front of the plate or down the 1st baseline. The intent of the rule as it applies to the running lane is to keep a baserunner from intentionally interfering/blocking the throwing lane to first when the baserunner is on his way to first base.

The play in question involved a bouncing ball 30 feet away from the plate to the left of the pitcher in between the mound and the third base line. The 45 foot running lane had nothing to do with the play because the throw was only impacted as Turner was literally contacting first base. Unlike little league, in MLB, there is no alternate orange first base in foul territory. Turner had no other way to touch first base, and he is entitled to the base. Turner is not required to take a banana route to the base. Particularly, in his final stride to the bag.

For those claiming that the rule was correctly applied, any first baseman could hold his glove in the baseline just in front of the base on every throw to first and claim interference, which is exactly what Gurriel did by not stretching for the ball. That is not the purpose of Rule 5.09(a)(11).

As Torre said, it was a judgment call requiring an interpretation of the rule, and the umps interpreted the rule incorrectly. Predictably, Torre defended the umps after the game as the call ended up not deciding the game, and it's in MLB's interest to not admit the call was wrong. With all of that said, the rule will be clarified in the off-season to ensure that a similar call is not made in the future.
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A lot of stuff here.

1. The rule doesn’t protect a throwing lane it protects the first baseman fielding a throw. Did you read the rule you quoted?

2. The rule has been around for a long time. First basemen don’t set up with their arm in the throwing lane because that’s dumb and wouldn’t work in the real world. You have a better chance just catching the ball and getting the out. Furthermore with the way obstruction rules are written now you are in jeopardy of being called for obstruction. Either way this rule has been around a while and your suggestion doesn’t work or you would have seen people try it.

3. The first baseman was squared like he should have been. They set up squared for throws coming from home. They all do that and he would have caught the ball if not interfered with.

The only thing the umpires had to judge was if turner ran out of the protected lane. By rule one foot out was enough. He had two out and it wasn’t close. Given that and that there was interference (with the catch not the throw) it’s a really easy call.

Maybe the rule needs to be changed. But it couldn’t be more clear. It’s only controversial for people who haven’t heard of a running lane before last night.
 
What was Strausberg saying after the game when he said after the first inning he had to do something with his glove so the Stros wouldn't pick up his signals? The cheating acusations vs the Astros fascinate me
 
Turd Ferguson said:
The only thing the umpires had to judge was if turner ran out of the protected lane. By rule one foot out was enough. He had two out and it wasn’t close.
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The reason your entire line of argument is just flat out wrong is because this is not what was called. The umpire and Torre have both said he was not out of the protected lane enough and that wasn't the call anyway.

The call was that he interfered with the first baseman at the bag. In real time it looked like Turner's arm might have hit his glove while he was running by him, the glove coming off drew the call. Now, ignoring the fact that 99% of runs to first by righties look exactly like Turner's did, and that it was the awful throw that pulled the first baseman's glove essentially in line with the bag, the replays clearly show Turner's arm didn't hit his glove, it was his left leg which landed perfectly centered in the middle of the base. The ball managed to hit him in the right leg, that's how far off target it was.

If it was a reviewable play it would have been immediately overturned once they saw his arm didn't touch him, but it isn't because it's not on whatever list determines what's reviewable. The whole "judgment call" thing is nonsense, plenty of reviews are still judgment calls.

If they hadn't blown the first call of the game, had terrible strike zones for the past two games, and gotten chewed out by both sides turning a spotlight onto the umps prior to this incident, they would have just said "sorry we missed that one" and moved on. But instead Torre's quasi-defending it because he feels like he has to. Pretty obvious even he knows it was simply a blown call.
 
palmab03 said:
What was Strausberg saying after the game when he said after the first inning he had to do something with his glove so the Stros wouldn't pick up his signals? The cheating acusations vs the Astros fascinate me
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He said he was tipping his pitches with the way his glove was doing something and one of his teammates caught it. They went into the tunnel between that inning & worked on it. All a part of baseball he said. Been around for years with batters picking up on what pitchers do or don't do.
 
palmab03 said:
What was Strausberg saying after the game when he said after the first inning he had to do something with his glove so the Stros wouldn't pick up his signals? The cheating acusations vs the Astros fascinate me
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How is it cheating if everyone can see it?

It would be stupid for them not to take advantage.
 
This an excerpt from the official comment on this rule:

Rule 5.09 (a)(11) Comment (Rule 6.05(k) Comment): The lines marking the three-foot lane are a part of that lane and a batter-runner is required to have both feet within the three-foot lane or on the lines marking the lane. The batter-runner is permitted to exit the three-foot lane by means of a step, stride, reach or slide in the immediate vicinity of first base for the sole purpose of touching first base.

Due to the angle of the throw from the pitcher (on the third base side of the mound), the only time Turner could have potentially blocked the throw or the catch was in his final stride to first base. Under the Baseball Rule comment referenced above, Turner "is permitted to exit the three foot lane... in the immediate vicinity of first base for the purpose of touching the bag". Turner's path to first base outside the 45 foot lane would've only been an issue if throw was coming up from the 1st base line, not a throw from the third base side of the mound. The runner is entitled to run outside of the lane when he is striding to the bag.

The fact that Turner was not in 45 foot lane as he ran from home plate is irrelevant because of where the angle of the throw came from as every runner is entitled to touch the first base bag outside of that lane. You seem caught up in the fact of where Turner was when he was running up the baseline, but that doesn't matter unless that running path impacted the throw to first, which it did not.

FWIW, no one runs in that running lane on a ball hit to the left side of the infield, and the rules do not require it. The rules do not require a baserunner to zig into the running lane halfway down the line and then zag back to the bag right at the base.
 
Pilchard said:
This an excerpt from the official comment on this rule:

Rule 5.09 (a)(11) Comment (Rule 6.05(k) Comment): The lines marking the three-foot lane are a part of that lane and a batter-runner is required to have both feet within the three-foot lane or on the lines marking the lane. The batter-runner is permitted to exit the three-foot lane by means of a step, stride, reach or slide in the immediate vicinity of first base for the sole purpose of touching first base.

Due to the angle of the throw from the pitcher (on the third base side of the mound), the only time Turner could have potentially blocked the throw or the catch was in his final stride to first base. Under the Baseball Rule comment referenced above, Turner "is permitted to exit the three foot lane... in the immediate vicinity of first base for the purpose of touching the bag". Turner's path to first base outside the 45 foot lane would've only been an issue if throw was coming up from the 1st base line, not a throw from the third base side of the mound. The runner is entitled to run outside of the lane when he is striding to the bag.

The fact that Turner was not in 45 foot lane as he ran from home plate is irrelevant because of where the angle of the throw came from as every runner is entitled to touch the first base bag outside of that lane. You seem caught up in the fact of where Turner was when he was running up the baseline, but that doesn't matter unless that running path impacted the throw to first, which it did not.

FWIW, no one runs in that running lane on a ball hit to the left side of the infield, and the rules do not require it. The rules do not require a baserunner to zig into the running lane halfway down the line and then zag back to the bag right at the base.
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Am I misunderstanding the part in bold? At no point when running down the first base line does Turner step on the line or run within the three-foot lane. He is in fair territory the entire time. If "the batter-runner is required to have both feet within the three-foot lane or on the lines marking the lane." Turner violated the quoted part. As for the final bolded sentence, how does he ever exit the three-foot lane if he is never in it in the first place? Turner clearly makes contact with the glove before hitting the bag.

Per the rule as written, it seems like the umps got it right. Good replay at 0:47 of this video.

[video]https://www.mlb.com/video/martinez-ejected-after-turner-out?t=world-series[/video]
 
TheReff said:
He said he was tipping his pitches with the way his glove was doing something and one of his teammates caught it. They went into the tunnel between that inning & worked on it. All a part of baseball he said. Been around for years with batters picking up on what pitchers do or don't do.
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Actually a pretty cool story. Here's the side-by-side comparison:
https://twitter.com/PitchingNinja/status/1189519830233309184?s=20

And it was discovered by a back office employee:
EII0kO0WkAAnOLe


Crazy.
 
Tickets for tonight's game going for as low as $330. Lowest for any game 7 in any sport in a very long time. Wish I lived near Houston...
 
Just saw the play in question for the first time. The runner clearly runs on the infield side of first base from home to first. If he had been called safe, Houston could have appealed the call for the route taken by the base runner. That call was overturned in every instance I have seen the play.

One of the fundamentals taught in Little league is to always stand or run to the right of the first or third base line (foul territory).
 
Hindsight is 20/20 but not sure they needed to pull Greinke. One bad pitch to Rendon. Missed strike call in the walk. Think I would’ve given him at least another batter as in control as he was all night.
 
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