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Thread: Covid-19 - Treatments & Vaccines

  1. #361
    Simplest explanation and Iím on my phone, the first dose creates a response that generates an adaptive immune response and memory, the antigens in a vaccine though donít last very long, itís not a live attenuated or reproducing viruses so the body has a limited amount to respond to. In a natural infection the body would continue to make the response better through antibody somatic hypermutation etc...

    Since the initial dose just primes the body for response the second dose trains the body to respond better, you could continuously boost over and over again to either make the initial antibody response last as well as make the response you do have adapt to be better. You will get some protection from the initial dose, if I had to make a guess some people would be 100% protected, most other just wouldnít get as sick. After the boost almost everyone wouldnít get sick, a few just wonít get as sick.

  2. #362
    The Pumpfaker Paul Hogan's Avatar
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    Posted on the chat thread that it looks like fat people will get the vaccine before not fat people. Why should those who put themselves at greater risk from dying from damn near everything get vaccinated before those who try to stay healthy ?

  3. #363
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Hogan View Post
    Posted on the chat thread that it looks like fat people will get the vaccine before not fat people. Why should those who put themselves at greater risk from dying from damn near everything get vaccinated before those who try to stay healthy ?
    Because cancer treatment profits are higher.

  4. #364
    England giving out vitamin D against the advice of dr. rafi

  5. #365
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Hogan View Post
    Posted on the chat thread that it looks like fat people will get the vaccine before not fat people. Why should those who put themselves at greater risk from dying from damn near everything get vaccinated before those who try to stay healthy ?
    I made this same argument at the Thanksgiving table with the fam. Back of the line with everyone else big guy.

  6. #366
    Older than Dirt WFU71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Hogan View Post
    Posted on the chat thread that it looks like fat people will get the vaccine before not fat people. Why should those who put themselves at greater risk from dying from damn near everything get vaccinated before those who try to stay healthy ?
    There are some racial issues related to obesity.

  7. #367
    Quote Originally Posted by WFcatamount22 View Post
    I made this same argument at the Thanksgiving table with the fam. Back of the line with everyone else big guy.
    Absent some major underlying disease, if you're still a fat fuck after 9 months of not a damn thing else to do, then you should be at the back of the line with the full-blown anti-maskers.

    As I said back in the spring, a major failing of the Rafi / Louie / We're-All-Gonna-Die fearmongering crowd was to present this as everyone has to wait around sequestering for Big Pharma to save us. Had the MSM narrative encouraged healthiness as a valid, material way to escape the at-risk category and reduce the effects of the virus, the overall global ramifications of the virus would be greatly reduced. Imagine the lower number of November/December deaths if people had started taking responsibility for their own health in March instead of just complaining about what everyone else was or was not doing.

  8. #368
    You said a lot of dumb ignorant things back then yeah

  9. #369
    I for one look forward to 2&2s apple a day keeps Covid at bay research for high susceptible individuals with decade long chronic health problems. Everyone knows that all it takes is 9 months to reverse something like the diabetes you've had for 15 years, its big pharma that just wants to keep you on that insulin. Not to mention the number one risk factor of old age, its pretty fucking simple all those people should have just become younger in the past 9 months.

  10. #370
    The Pumpfaker Paul Hogan's Avatar
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    So some fat 30-year old should get the vaccine before a healthy 50-year old ? Fuck that shit.

  11. #371
    Too many American live unhealthy lives and that impacts every aspect of health care, including dealing with the pandemic.

    There's lots of blame to go around on that front:

    - The government for failing to adopt programs that promote a healthy diet and provide an infrastructure with exercise options for all
    - Big pharma and other corporations that make huge money by focusing on treating (and addicting) the unhealthy rather than preventative programs
    - People who refuse to take care of themselves

  12. #372
    Quote Originally Posted by 2&2 Slider To Leyritz View Post
    Absent some major underlying disease, if you're still a fat fuck after 9 months of not a damn thing else to do, then you should be at the back of the line with the full-blown anti-maskers.

    As I said back in the spring, a major failing of the Rafi / Louie / We're-All-Gonna-Die fearmongering crowd was to present this as everyone has to wait around sequestering for Big Pharma to save us. Had the MSM narrative encouraged healthiness as a valid, material way to escape the at-risk category and reduce the effects of the virus, the overall global ramifications of the virus would be greatly reduced. Imagine the lower number of November/December deaths if people had started taking responsibility for their own health in March instead of just complaining about what everyone else was or was not doing.
    Yeah, you have said a lot of dumb things over the past 8 months, but this was up there. Of course people should be healthy and watch their weight. Guess what, that's not new advice. And making that the public health message would have made zero difference regarding this infectious disease. You want to know what would have made a difference? A coordinated and consistent federal approach regarding distancing, lock-downs, tracing, and masking. And there is a ton of evidence that this approach would have been extremely effective - just look at the countries that did this. If you really want to be frustrated, look at New Zealand. They have not had a single COVID death in 3 months! One of the best death rates in the US is Hawaii at 174 deaths per million; New Zealand has 5 deaths per million.

    And if telling the truth and accurately predicting the severity of the pandemic is "we-are-all-going-to-die-fear-mongering" then I guess I'm guilty as charged. And finally, dogging on physicians and the medical community for this is a real dick move.

  13. #373

    Covid-19 - Treatments & Vaccines

    Seems like, so far, most predictive models have over estimated mortality rates by about 5-10%. Which, given the improvement in treatment therapeutics over the course of the pandemic, is a pretty reasonable and small error term. Iíve not seen a single ďweíre all gonna dieĒ report but Iíve seen a lot of ď500k Americans are going to die by January 1Ē reports.

    Who is using hyperbole here?
    Last edited by birdman; 12-04-2020 at 05:20 PM.
    Birds are real.

  14. #374
    Taking out the Trump politicization and failures another huge group that deserves a lot of blame is the media. People already have a very bad ability to make risk calculations, there's almost zero understanding of percentages, odds or pretty much anything to do with math. So when 2&2 says something like everyone is going to die, its more from a perspective of what the media slants too then anything grounded in reality. Those companies love the clicks, they don't care that its disruptive, its why they loved them some trump, anything for ratings and clicks. There are too many stories about anecdotal people dying, random freak occurrences that get amplified as some universal truth, and normal scientific studies being twisted into the worst possible outcomes.

    With that said there is a serious American problem where society is just broken. Nobody cares about anyone else, its just me, maybe my family, and fuck anyone else. Like when asked what people think the covid death rate is, some people say something crazy like 20%. Yet, they are being asked that question and giving that answer in a crowded bar. So I can only imagine if they understood true risks and death rates what they would do.

  15. #375
    Quote Originally Posted by Louis Gossett Jr View Post
    I for one look forward to 2&2s apple a day keeps Covid at bay research for high susceptible individuals with decade long chronic health problems. Everyone knows that all it takes is 9 months to reverse something like the diabetes you've had for 15 years, its big pharma that just wants to keep you on that insulin. Not to mention the number one risk factor of old age, its pretty fucking simple all those people should have just become younger in the past 9 months.
    So if said diabetic had utilized the last 9 months starting in March to lose 75 lbs, he wouldn't be in a better position to fend off Covid if he gets it in December? Get out of here with that bullshit. Again, absent a major disease (and no, obesity doesn't count in this situation), if you can't use a 9 month dead period to get in shape, with the literal threat of dying from a pandemic should you catch it to use as serious motivation, then you are flat fucked to begin with and don't even bother showing up for life.

    And yes I have no problem blaming the medical community for not pushing that message. How many hundreds of doctors were all over TV in the spring espousing about the pandemic? I did not hear one single one of them ever say "hey, this may last a while, use this downtime to Rocky IV your ass into shape in case you get it". Hell, I brought it up on here in the spring and you two morons tried to shoot it down as nonsense while you lamented about a national response that clearly was not going to happen. But, as usual, in hindsight I was correct.

  16. #376
    Man, why oh why didn't Fauci and Birx think of that!!
    I love mankind...itís people I canít stand!!

  17. #377
    Quote Originally Posted by ConnorEl View Post
    Man, why oh why didn't Fauci and Birx think of that!!
    I know! It's so simple! We should have also created magical unicorns that fart COVID repellant.

    2&2, show me the evidence that a diabetic that loses 75 lbs has a lower death rate from COVID. I'll save you the frantic Googling - there is none.

  18. #378
    Quote Originally Posted by Rafi View Post
    I know! It's so simple! We should have also created magical unicorns that fart COVID repellant.

    2&2, show me the evidence that a diabetic that loses 75 lbs has a lower death rate from COVID. I'll save you the frantic Googling - there is none.
    also 2&2, show us the evidence that telling an obese person to lose weight because of Covid would be more effective than the annual reminder to lose weight

  19. #379
    The 2&2 key to not getting covid is to bootstrap yourself to being healthy. Easy peasy.

  20. #380
    presumably 2&2 also a big proponent of addressing access to healthy foods, green space, time off work to exercise and cook, etc.

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