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2020 Presidential Election: Biden v. Trump

When you’re talking to someone who just said they don’t support mass murder and you simply say “I disagree” without saying specifically what you disagree with, it could be taken as you advocating for mass murder.
 
I don't know why this needs clarifying, but my "i disagree" was meant as "i disagree that voting for democrats=favoring solutions that aren't more mass murder."
 
PhDeac said:
How was I supposed to interpret this any differently? You're rejecting voting and entertaining violence as a solution. And then you say this.
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I think that the "capitalism=mass murder" posts make the context of these clear.
 
PhDeac said:
...You're rejecting voting and entertaining violence as a solution....
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What is voting a “solution” to? Does the total
amount of voters participating in an election matter to you? No. If 50 million less people voted in 2020 than voted in 2016 you wouldn’t give a shit beyond your partisan interest in the Democratic Party winning. This isn’t about voting - it’s about rhetorically supporting the Democratic Party - demanding that people support the party and politics you believe in, despite our objections to it.

You continue to falsely portray leftist voters as non-voters simply because we don’t believe in the efficacy of 2 party politics, yet we still vote I’ve voted plenty of times in my life, and I’ve never had my enthusiasm measured at the polls. You might be shitting Stars and Stripes compared to me, but our votes are worth the same.
 
it's sad because this is a topic that I'm genuinely passionate about but good god the last few pages
 
Ph, This didn’t require Congress.

 
That’s great. Unfortunately, the people of Philly need to elect city leaders who won’t violate that agreement and if they elect judges, judges that will uphold the agreement.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
What is voting a “solution” to? Does the total
amount of voters participating in an election matter to you? No. If 50 million less people voted in 2020 than voted in 2016 you wouldn’t give a shit beyond your partisan interest in the Democratic Party winning. This isn’t about voting - it’s about rhetorically supporting the Democratic Party - demanding that people support the party and politics you believe in, despite our objections to it.

You continue to falsely portray leftist voters as non-voters simply because we don’t believe in the efficacy of 2 party politics, yet we still vote I’ve voted plenty of times in my life, and I’ve never had my enthusiasm measured at the polls. You might be shitting Stars and Stripes compared to me, but our votes are worth the same.
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Stop misrepresenting what I say. It gets really old. You’re purposefully doing it because there’s no way you honestly believe that I said voters are non-voters.

I’m not portraying “leftist voters” as non-voters. I’m talking about people who claim voting doesn’t matter and but have no other plans for societal change aside from hyperlocal action which I support.

I have not generalized to all leftists. I definitely have said something as ridiculous as saying voters aren’t voters.

We’ve been talking about voting. If you want to have a discussion about the virtues of the Democratic Party, that’s fine. But the conversation is about voting. Let’s be really you thought voting was important when you thought Bernie was going to win the primary. He didn’t. Now you want to burn the whole thing down instead of doing the work of politics. Make a case for your cause with the people and with elected officials. Build a coalition around your ideas. Run politicians who support those ideas. Vote them in office and continue to support them. It’s what Progressives have been doing very effectively over the last five years with the exception of Bernie running for President.

More people support universal healthcare, free higher education, $15 minimum wage, and other progressive causes than ever before including the majority of the hated Democrats. Giving up on voting when new voters are going to be majority BIPOC and more leftist than ever before seems ridiculous and strictly a reaction to one old career politician not winning a primary.
 
What’s tired is your constant whatabouting the failure of Bernie Sanders every time the Democratic Party and electoralism are criticized. It’s the same shit over and over, you pretend not to understand a POV, when in actuality you really just disagree with it. So you’re welcome for me explaining Zoe’s point more thoroughly, I’ll just ignore your predictable dickhead trolling about Bernie Sanders just because you don’t like her opinion. I’m nearly certain that she didn’t support Bernie anyway - he wasn’t radical enough for her.
 
Im sure next time Ph asks about alternatives to electoralism, it’ll be in good faith.

:rolleyes:
 
 
ChrisL68 said:
The only thing that the rhetoric of you two accomplishes is making the reactionary right-wing rhetoric of people like sailor and Angus sound reasonable to a lot of people.
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This is crazy talk.
 
https://www.inquirer.com/opinion/commentary/tom-ridge-trump-biden-election-2020-vote-20200927.html

"Imagine the impact of President Trump traveling to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention back in February, and talking plainly about the challenge Mother Nature intended to throw at us, and how this country, working together, public and private sector, would confront it with all the fortitude and resources we could bring to bear. Then imagine him meeting with journalists the next day, appearing with a face mask, and calmly walking through the steps that his fellow citizens could and should take to do their part to combat this new challenge. Imagine the difference in attitude and outcomes. Perhaps I have more trust in Americans being able to handle the truth than the president.

Donald Trump has proven over these last four years he is incapable of such leadership. It is not within him. He lacks the empathy, integrity, intellect and maturity to lead. He sows division along political, racial and religious lines. And he routinely dismisses the opinions of experts who know far more about the subject at hand than he does – intelligence, military, and public health. Our country has paid dearly in lives lost, social unrest, economic hardship and our standing in the world."
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
What’s tired is your constant whatabouting the failure of Bernie Sanders every time the Democratic Party and electoralism are criticized. It’s the same shit over and over, you pretend not to understand a POV, when in actuality you really just disagree with it. So you’re welcome for me explaining Zoe’s point more thoroughly, I’ll just ignore your predictable dickhead trolling about Bernie Sanders just because you don’t like her opinion. I’m nearly certain that she didn’t support Bernie anyway - he wasn’t radical enough for her.
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How is that "whatabouting?" I'm saying your take on electoralism is rooted in your single-minded belief in one career politician. And that's blinding you to the electoral gains progressives are making at all levels of politics.

It's hard to say I disagree with a point that doesn't exist.

1. Organize
2. ????
3. Broad Social Change

I'm asking what #2 is and you all aren't answering. I can't disagree if you don't give an answer. I'm filling in the gaps as best I can. If there's an alternative to the shitty system of politics we have, I'd like to know what it is. But you all aren't telling me. You're just bashing me.

MHBDemon said:
Im sure next time Ph asks about alternatives to electoralism, it’ll be in good faith.

:rolleyes:
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Give me an answer. Your only answer was a hyperlocal success in Philly that still depends on electing the right people to city government.
 
BarcaDeac said:
So dumb. If the Electoral College doesn’t work, just use the B version of it.
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You gotta a love a system where the party that clearly has an overall majority in the House doesn't get to vote that way for President of the United States, but instead the vote is done according to which party has a majority of each state delegation. But no, our Constitution doesn't need reforming or updating at all.
 
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