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BillBrasky Memorial Political Chat Thread

Political Chat Thread - All Topics & Rants Welcome

Lots of posters on here absolutely certain that the default Democratic constituency is moderate and requires a moderate candidate. Those posters make a lot of good points, but what those posters never acknowledge is that the electoral difficulty they claim is due to a moderate swing constituency, is in large part a result of moderate establishment Democrats corruption and ineptitude.

Point is - you can’t use past Democratic campaign results as a measuring stick for the future, if those past candidates were picked for their ability to raise money, and their campaigns were run by grifters. It’s far too convenient for moderates to deny the viability of progressiveness without addressing the political ineptitude tied to moderate politics.
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
Adding on to that point, I didn’t post the audio or bring up the entire clip because I didn’t want to rehash the same debate about Defund The Police. I just thought it was ridiculous that Biden would speak so scornfully and condescendingly to the head of the fucking NAACP about a very pertinent criticism made about Tom Vilsack, the stupid fuck who fired Shirley Sherrod over a Breitbart smear job
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Ok. The problem is, in my mind, the out of context clip does not make the point you want it to make without understanding that context. Terse? Jerky? Sure. Its also potentially disrespectful but so may soundbites are easily taken out of context.
 
Also, I don't disagree with much of your next posts. Standing still is the democrat default and has killed them. Say what you will but the gop barreled ahead and changed the game. Granted their change was to double down on white grievance and yearning for past glory while saying buzz words while never actually giving a shit about policy and helping people but it has worked for them. Do we need more examples of party over country voters? Probably a few examples lurking on these here boards...
 
myDeaconmyhand said:
https://mainernews.com/how-sara-gideon-lost-to-collins-the-day-after-she-entered-the-race

“...A review of the Gideon campaign’s finance filings reveals page after page of big payments to out-of-state consulting firms and media companies. DSCC executive director Mindy Myers personally received over $100,000 from Gideon’s campaign for consulting services. Bully Pulpit Interactive, a Democratic ad agency that also worked for Biden this year, was paid over $8 million. Aisle 518 Strategies, a D.C. digital fundraising outfit, raked in over $6 million.

Grassroots Media, an ad-buying operation based in Philadelphia, pocketed over $21 million from the Gideon campaign. The company (which did not respond to Mainer’s request for comment) lists only two people on its website as employees: president and founder Mike D’Ettorre and an assistant hired fresh out of college last summer.
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This is extra infuriating because, unlike the other randos recruited solely for their ability to raise money, Gideon had won elections before in Maine, and should have been able to run a campaign without the DSCC / Schumer meddling.
 
Good posts. The Maine debacle is more evidence that Democrats would work best as a decentralized party whose primary role is to provide money and resources to local organizers united by a few core values centered around basic human rights. There should definitely not be an organization that picks candidates or actively defends incumbents from primary challenges. Leave that to the voters.

I highly recommend listening to this Pod Save America interview with messaging expert Anat Shenker-Osorio. She is an advocate of using the Race-Class Narrative as a core communication strategy.
https://www.stitcher.com/show/pod-save-america/episode/the-mitch-who-stole-christmas-80062820 (start at 75:45)

She made one of the best straightforward points I've seen about the whole "Defund" discussion. Minnesota was at the epicenter of the national conversation about policing. Hillary beat Trump 46.4% to 44.9% in 2016. Republicans targeted Minnesota and all in with racist messaging mostly aimed Ilhan Omar. Biden beat Trump 52.6% to 45.4% this year. That's going from +1.5% to +7.2%.

If there's anywhere "Defund the Police" and progressive messaging would have hurt Democrats, it's Minnesota. It didn't. Now she was clear that it's not like "Defund the Police" increase magins on its on. No. They did the work on the ground. They framed the police funding issues as "Fund Our Lives." Here's an example:
https://wemakemn.com/toolkit

No matter what we look like or where we live, we want our families to be whole and our communities to be vibrant. But the people entrusted to serve and protect our communities target, detain and even kill Black people like George Floyd, Tony McDade and Breonna Taylor, among too many others. All the while, a handful of politicians throw out lies to divide us. They think that if we’re made to fear each other, we’ll ignore it when police officers meant to uphold the law harm our communities. And they hope we’ll look the other way when politicians elected to govern in our name hand millions to corporations to militarize law enforcement and deny resources for the schools and healthcare we actually need.

Together - from cities to suburbs to towns - we make Minnesota. And we can demand that our elected leaders fund our lives, creating the schools, services and care we all need, so that our communities are safe for every one of us.
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That's the type of statement progressives, liberals, and centrists can get behind. It identifies the victims we want to help. It establishes who the political enemies are. It names grievances with policing. It establishes that "we" are the solution.
 
deaconson said:
the out of context clip does not make the point you want it to make without understanding that context.
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Au contraire, Joe Biden speaking like a condescending asshole to the head of the NAACP does perfectly make my point that “look, here’s Joe Biden speaking like an asshole to the head of the NAACP”.

The wider context is Joe Biden speaking and rambling like a condescending asshole to an entire room of highly respected black political organizers and community leaders. But sure, if you want to hear old Amtrak Joe tell a 5 minutes story about an old friend of his introducing him to the term “overstand” feel free to listen to the rest of the clip.
 
Ahem
 
So you mention and attempt to explain a "wider context" without providing the actual words for me to hear on my own. Sounds like an opinion. I'd prefer to hear and decide for myself.

Second you post a "gotcha tweet" where bell recommends I hear the entire 15 minutes. Got me... I guess.
 
Wasn’t the Vilsack-Sherrod debacle relatively early on in his tenure? Didn’t he apologize and try to make amends when he realized everyone (including the NAACP, which initially applauded her forced resignation) had been duped by the doctored Breitbart clip? Didn’t he continue to serve under Obama for a long time subsequently?

Anyhow, I’m sure good arguments can be made for a choice other than Vilsack. But I’m not sure rehashing this mistake is a good one.
 
deaconson said:
So you mention and attempt to explain a "wider context" without providing the actual words for me to hear on my own. Sounds like an opinion. I'd prefer to hear and decide for myself.

Second you post a "gotcha tweet" where bell recommends I hear the entire 15 minutes. Got me... I guess.
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Bell is tweeting at his 100k Twitter followers, I’m posting to to the same 20 Tunnels posters that I’ve been arguing with for 8(?)years, who just had an extended debate over Defund The Police recently. Google is a click away, if you want to hear the full Biden audio clip you are free to do so.
 
True. But I'm less likely to go searching for the cause of your anger than I am to click the link(s) you provide to back up your pov. Unless you're not interested in being persuasive. that's cool.
 
deaconson said:
True. But I'm less likely to go searching for the cause of your anger than I am to click the link(s) you provide to back up your pov. Unless you're not interested in being persuasive. that's cool.
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I’ll repeat, I’m not bringing up another debate over the thing you so clearly want to debate again. It’s been 2 days, at this point I’m not going to post the link out of stubbornness. You disagree, fine, move on.
 
How to win friends and influence people by Dale Carnegie with a new covid 19 forward by mdmh
 
Cuomo accused of sexual assault by a former staffer now running for borough president of Manhattan
 
Lindsey Boylan accused Cuomo of sexually harassing her, writing on Twitter that Cuomo "sexually harassed me for years. Many saw it, and watched." Boylan further tweeted "And I *know* I am not the only woman."

She added she was "angry to be put in this situation at all."

Boylan, 36, has not provided any corroborating information or detailed allegations against the governor.

...


Personnel memos written in 2018, obtained by The Associated Press, indicate that Boylan resigned from Cuomo's administration after she was confronted about complaints about her own office behavior.

Several women complained to Empire State Development�s human resources department that "Ms. Boyland had behaved in a way towards them that was harassing, belittling, and had yelled and been generally unprofessional," wrote the administration�s ethics officer, Julia Pinover Kupiec in one memo.

Boylan resigned after meeting with officials including Cuomo�s top lawyer, Alphonso David, to be "counseled" about the complaints...
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https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ides-sexual-harassment-allegation/6533247002/
 
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/15/opinions/obama-defund-the-police-mccoy/index.html

“...We are six months out from the protests and momentum has slowed. Where do we go from here? First, it is important to recognize that a true "reckoning" not only requires a deep, collective introspection about our history of structural racism, but also a "revolution of values," described by activists such as Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., and Grace Lee Boggs as a shift in our principles towards a more fair and just society -- for everyone, especially the most marginalized. A true reckoning with racism should inspire us to seek new and transformative ways of performing justice that are grounded in more non-violent and community-based approaches to public safety...”
 
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