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Republican Bullshit

WYOMINGdeac said:
In my 30s...no boomer. Voted for Biden and then down ballot republicans. Have some strong conservative views, some very liberal views, and the majority of "somewhere in the middle" views. Should have clarified, but my comment wasn't pertaining to Tuberville's comments specifically (he's clearly in loony-tunes camp) but referring to The Tunnels holistically... I am appalled by both extremes, and think each group should be calling out their side's extreme more than the others. As a center-right guy, I find myself calling out "my side's" extreme behavior more: Trumpism, QAnon, rise in white supremacy, Christians blending with Trumpism are massive, massive problems. I'm way more concerned about ridding the right of all Toxic Trumpisms than pointing out the left's major issues. Why would I bother? No amount of finger pointing to the other side does any convincing (see "How to Win Friends and Influence People"). But RVAT and other voices pointing out the flaws in their own party is actually very productive. That's why I happily voted for Biden.

Finding loonies on the far right is easy. Same could be said of the far left. I'd encourage yall to spend more time looking in the mirror at the short comings of your own party. I see none of that here.

I love my Deacon fam (let's get it done tomorrow, btw), but I truly am sad to come over here every once in a while and see how deep into the echo chamber this place has fallen. It's the same type of echo-chamber and confirmation bias that is so prevalent on the right: Fox News caricaturing AOC/Pelosi/Deep State just further distances themselves from reality.

Really hoping we can come together as Americans and heal. I really believe we can, and I pray each day that we do.
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This isn't a bad post all in all. But if you think the bold is true, you should definitely watch the ChrisL/Townie or MDsquared/PH interactions. There are no credible pubs to argue with on here anymore, so we've been in eat our own mode for a while.

And nobody hates anything like DeacMan hates math.
 
WYOMINGdeac said:
In my 30s...no boomer. Voted for Biden and then down ballot republicans. Have some strong conservative views, some very liberal views, and the majority of "somewhere in the middle" views. Should have clarified, but my comment wasn't pertaining to Tuberville's comments specifically (he's clearly in loony-tunes camp) but referring to The Tunnels holistically... I am appalled by both extremes, and think each group should be calling out their side's extreme more than the others. As a center-right guy, I find myself calling out "my side's" extreme behavior more: Trumpism, QAnon, rise in white supremacy, Christians blending with Trumpism are massive, massive problems. I'm way more concerned about ridding the right of all Toxic Trumpisms than pointing out the left's major issues. Why would I bother? No amount of finger pointing to the other side does any convincing (see "How to Win Friends and Influence People"). But RVAT and other voices pointing out the flaws in their own party is actually very productive. That's why I happily voted for Biden.

Finding loonies on the far right is easy. Same could be said of the far left. I'd encourage yall to spend more time looking in the mirror at the short comings of your own party. I see none of that here.

I love my Deacon fam (let's get it done tomorrow, btw), but I truly am sad to come over here every once in a while and see how deep into the echo chamber this place has fallen. It's the same type of echo-chamber and confirmation bias that is so prevalent on the right: Fox News caricaturing AOC/Pelosi/Deep State just further distances themselves from reality.

Really hoping we can come together as Americans and heal. I really believe we can, and I pray each day that we do.
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yeah but the right has moved into batshit crazy territory and the left is on completely solid ideologic ground even at its "extreme." You must be aware that pretty much every other leading 1st world economy in the world has shit like single-payer and gun control and paid leave and pro choice and gay marriage and progressive taxation, and voting rights, and environmental protection and all the stuff the left is trying to achieve. Our echo chamber is the god damn real world, friend. What exactly, on the far left, is a "major issue" as you put it? We can point to myriad examples of those policies working in major, complex economies....and the right twists itself into contortions to make it seem like we want to put everyone in a fucking gulag. Get outa here with that shit.

Our arguments on the left aren't really about those policies being extreme, just on our ability to run on them and win since 70 million americans out there can't and don't understand that these are reasonable positions.

What is appalling about any of the left's propositions? You can say you don't agree, but appalled? lol good lord
 
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WYOMINGdeac said:
As a center-right guy, I find myself calling out "my side's" extreme behavior more: Trumpism, QAnon, rise in white supremacy, Christians blending with Trumpism are massive, massive problems. I'm way more concerned about ridding the right of all Toxic Trumpisms than pointing out the left's major issues.
Click to expand...

As someone leaning right, how can you say that Trumpism is an “extreme behavior” when over 70 million people just voted for him? Add into that that not many prominent republicans have spoken out about the baseless fraud claims. From where I sit, it seems as though Trumpism is the right currently, and any republicans who dislike that are the “extreme” left of the republican party.
 
deacon14 said:
As someone leaning right, how can you say that Trumpism is an “extreme behavior” when over 70 million people just voted for him? Add into that that not many prominent republicans have spoken out about the baseless fraud claims. From where I sit, it seems as though Trumpism is the right currently, and any republicans who dislike that are the “extreme” left of the republican party.
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Exactly, as an ex-republican, what is the party even for anymore? They have no ideas or policy goals besides more tax cuts for the rich and owning the libs. The party completely sold out to Trump; there isn't a republican part only a Trump party. You can't also say its an extreme wing when Trump pulled out ~10-12 million new voters.
 
deacon14 said:
As someone leaning right, how can you say that Trumpism is an “extreme behavior” when over 70 million people just voted for him? Add into that that not many prominent republicans have spoken out about the baseless fraud claims. From where I sit, it seems as though Trumpism is the right currently, and any republicans who dislike that are the “extreme” left of the republican party.
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To clarify since I never post on the Tunnels, I was saying that he leans right, not that I do
 
WYOMINGdeac said:
In my 30s...no boomer. Voted for Biden and then down ballot republicans. Have some strong conservative views, some very liberal views, and the majority of "somewhere in the middle" views. Should have clarified, but my comment wasn't pertaining to Tuberville's comments specifically (he's clearly in loony-tunes camp) but referring to The Tunnels holistically... I am appalled by both extremes, and think each group should be calling out their side's extreme more than the others. As a center-right guy, I find myself calling out "my side's" extreme behavior more: Trumpism, QAnon, rise in white supremacy, Christians blending with Trumpism are massive, massive problems. I'm way more concerned about ridding the right of all Toxic Trumpisms than pointing out the left's major issues. Why would I bother? No amount of finger pointing to the other side does any convincing (see "How to Win Friends and Influence People"). But RVAT and other voices pointing out the flaws in their own party is actually very productive. That's why I happily voted for Biden.

Finding loonies on the far right is easy. Same could be said of the far left. I'd encourage yall to spend more time looking in the mirror at the short comings of your own party. I see none of that here.

I love my Deacon fam (let's get it done tomorrow, btw), but I truly am sad to come over here every once in a while and see how deep into the echo chamber this place has fallen. It's the same type of echo-chamber and confirmation bias that is so prevalent on the right: Fox News caricaturing AOC/Pelosi/Deep State just further distances themselves from reality.

Really hoping we can come together as Americans and heal. I really believe we can, and I pray each day that we do.
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Basically, you just enabled all of the legislative pubs who never stood up to trump and put party over country to just do the same thing again when the pub yahoo mob supports their next autocratic nominee. The only lesson that the enablers will learn is to pay an electoral price. Instead, they aren't paying any price to pandering to the extreme low information base of the party.
 
deacon14 said:
As someone leaning right, how can you say that Trumpism is an “extreme behavior” when over 70 million people just voted for him? Add into that that not many prominent republicans have spoken out about the baseless fraud claims. From where I sit, it seems as though Trumpism is the right currently, and any republicans who dislike that are the “extreme” left of the republican party.
Click to expand...

Trump himself is only a symptom of the Republican disease.
 
Wyoming if you spend any time here and really read discussions you’ll find quite a few former “center right” individuals who have found themselves squarely in “the left” simply by standing still and sticking to their original principles.

Trump has dragged the party over the RW conspiracy cliff man. It’s gone.
 
There are posters here that discuss conservative policies. See the above examples.

However there are no serious posters here that discuss Republican policies. There are no Republican policies anymore other than Trump/religion/gun/cut all taxes but raise spending. Not a lot to debate there really.
 
mako1331 said:
This isn't a bad post all in all. But if you think the bold is true, you should definitely watch the ChrisL/Townie or MDsquared/PH interactions. There are no credible pubs to argue with on here anymore, so we've been in eat our own mode for a while.

And nobody hates anything like DeacMan hates math.
Click to expand...

Yep, this is what I came here to post.
 
06deacon said:
Wyoming if you spend any time here and really read discussions you’ll find quite a few former “center right” individuals who have found themselves squarely in “the left” simply by standing still and sticking to their original principles.

Trump has dragged the party over the RW conspiracy cliff man. It’s gone.
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Yep. There’s plenty of criticisms of the Democratic Party on this board. I guess you could say that most of the board talks about the Dems like we talk about the last 10 years of Wake basketball. Homers but very critical and looking for something better.
 
WYOMING, what are your "strong conservative" views and what are you "very liberal" views?
 
deacon14 said:
As someone leaning right, how can you say that Trumpism is an “extreme behavior” when over 70 million people just voted for him? Add into that that not many prominent republicans have spoken out about the baseless fraud claims. From where I sit, it seems as though Trumpism is the right currently, and any republicans who dislike that are the “extreme” left of the republican party.
Click to expand...

Let's talk about the 70m who voted for Trump. I would guess my circle of friends and family break down pretty evenly: 1/3 solidly Dem, 1/3 center-right that voted for Biden, 1/3 solidly right, voted for Trump. I can tell you I had many friends on the right who were literally in line to vote trying to decide which way to go.

Before you bash my friends and call them the worst possible humans for voting for Trump, again, ask yourself what you would do in a similar situation. What would you all do in the same, parallel position? Genuinely asking. Before you blurt out, "I would never do the equivalent of voting for Trump," think about it: What if the scenario was Alyssa Milano vs Dick Cheney (I would say this is as comparable as I can come up with for 2016. Caricature of the left vs. a republican that democrats truly believe is the devil...Is that close? Cardi B v McConnell? Dealers choice, yall pick). Let's say you agree with 70% of Alyssa's policies (5% of Cheney's) and while Alyssa was saying some head scratching things on the campaign trail (let's say she said some off-the-cuff comments that sounded like she was going to have some scary-radical policy (that you don't agree with) that encroached on some things republicans hold dear (ie religious liberty, or something)), but you think, overall, her policies would be great. You reason that her antics will be quelled by checks and balances and her policies would be far superior to horrible Cheney. So you roll the dice with Alyssa.

Pick your own characters, but my point remains: my family members and friends who ended up sucking it up and voting for Trump (I do not know a *single* person in my life who is an actual Trump fan (I know they are out there, see my original post)) are just as opposed to racism and bigotry as you are. They just have a different worldview, and in a 2 party system, you aren't voting for Trump in a vacuum. You have to compare one human to one other human and make your determination. I came to a different conclusion as those family and friends, but I do not fault them at all. And if you would have voted for Alyssa Milano over Cheney, you shouldn't either.
 
Well, Cardi B did do her damndest to warn us about the coronavirus, so that’s gotta count for something.
 
WYOMINGdeac said:
Let's talk about the 70m who voted for Trump. I would guess my circle of friends and family break down pretty evenly: 1/3 solidly Dem, 1/3 center-right that voted for Biden, 1/3 solidly right, voted for Trump. I can tell you I had many friends on the right who were literally in line to vote trying to decide which way to go.

Before you bash my friends and call them the worst possible humans for voting for Trump, again, ask yourself what you would do in a similar situation. What would you all do in the same, parallel position? Genuinely asking. Before you blurt out, "I would never do the equivalent of voting for Trump," think about it: What if the scenario was Alyssa Milano vs Dick Cheney (I would say this is as comparable as I can come up with for 2016. Caricature of the left vs. a republican that democrats truly believe is the devil...Is that close? Cardi B v McConnell? Dealers choice, yall pick). Let's say you agree with 70% of Alyssa's policies (5% of Cheney's) and while Alyssa was saying some head scratching things on the campaign trail (let's say she said some off-the-cuff comments that sounded like she was going to have some scary-radical policy (that you don't agree with) that encroached on some things republicans hold dear (ie religious liberty, or something)), but you think, overall, her policies would be great. You reason that her antics will be quelled by checks and balances and her policies would be far superior to horrible Cheney. So you roll the dice with Alyssa.

Pick your own characters, but my point remains: my family members and friends who ended up sucking it up and voting for Trump (I do not know a *single* person in my life who is an actual Trump fan (I know they are out there, see my original post)) are just as opposed to racism and bigotry as you are. They just have a different worldview, and in a 2 party system, you aren't voting for Trump in a vacuum. You have to compare one human to one other human and make your determination. I came to a different conclusion as those family and friends, but I do not fault them at all. And if you would have voted for Alyssa Milano over Cheney, you shouldn't either.
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That is really an awful comparison though, the more equivalent if you want to go that way is say Alyssa Milano vs Mitt Romney or Alyssa Milano vs. Jeb Bush. Those are the republican equivalents of Joe Biden. He isn't some scary "socialist", he's basically the most traditional republican democrat there is. If you can't vote for that vs a narcissistic sociopath in Trump then you have your own reasoning problems.
 
Cardi B knows her shit. Honestly, that’s on you if you treat her like a caricature.
 
I think if anyone is equating Joe Biden as a politician to Dick Cheney or Mitch McConnell, then they clearly have not actually examined Biden as a candidate, and instead only listened to what conservative media has claimed about Biden (and all democrats). Biden was pretty much the most centrist candidate in the dem primary, why would your hypothetical include two republicans who aren’t even close to centrist?
 
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