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Republican Bullshit

Yeah we do, in fact we've done a lot more than scratch our heads...RVAT and Lincoln Party formed groups that went way beyond scratching their heads...and a lot of us conservatives straight up voted for Biden. Hard to imagine that much activation among liberals if the roles were reversed and yall had a nutjob in the White House.

Do you not think my post above is valid? Do you really believe liberals don't need to change and look in the mirror, too? Wouldn't you rather open your arms to people like me rather than leaving us politically homeless?

You’re not politically homeless. You’re a Republican who would rather have two republicans to choose from every 4 years.
 
Yeah we do, in fact we've done a lot more than scratch our heads...RVAT and Lincoln Party formed groups that went way beyond scratching their heads...and a lot of us conservatives straight up voted for Biden. Hard to imagine that much activation among liberals if the roles were reversed and yall had a nutjob in the White House.

Do you not think my post above is valid? Do you really believe liberals don't need to change and look in the mirror, too? Wouldn't you rather open your arms to people like me rather than leaving us politically homeless?

I think Democrats need to do a better job promoting a popular message to appeal to more people.

But I also realize that it’s just assumed more people will vote for the Democrat in presidential elections yet the burden is on Democrats to appeal to more people.

Given the numbers and demographic and life course shifts that favor Democrats, there should be pressure on Republicans to “learn lessons” and appeal to more Democrats.

Nothing you described is comparable to that. In fact it’s the opposite. Republicans who aren’t happy with the party aren’t trying to bring more people in. They’re trying to guide more people out.
 
Yeah we do, in fact we've done a lot more than scratch our heads...RVAT and Lincoln Party formed groups that went way beyond scratching their heads...and a lot of us conservatives straight up voted for Biden. Hard to imagine that much activation among liberals if the roles were reversed and yall had a nutjob in the White House.

Do you not think my post above is valid? Do you really believe liberals don't need to change and look in the mirror, too? Wouldn't you rather open your arms to people like me rather than leaving us politically homeless?

I think if you put in the slightest bit of effort you’ll find plenty of posts and threads about things Democrats need to do differently.

But it’s not like we nominated and elected a fucking nutjob to the Presidency. It is not primarily the Democrats’ fault that the people on the right elected this piece of shit.
 
I’m so over these former republican “centrist” ass voters blaming the democrats for not doing more to stop the Republican Party from voting in a racist autocratic piece of shit. How about we blame the republicans for that. Personal responsibility and everything.
 
I certainly don’t blame the Democrats for Trump. They had a primary, and he beat the “best” their party had to offer. The issue with Democrats and messaging has to start with the understanding that Democrats have a much harder job to do. Figuring out how to progress and improve lives is hard, and convincing people your plan will work is harder. Figuring out how to scare people into believing change is bad and will affect them negatively is easy. It’s kind of like being the defense lawyer in a civil case. At the end of the day, even if you have nothing, you can sit back and say “prove it.”

With that hill to climb, Democrats - and I don’t just mean the politicians, I mean everyone advocating for progressive reforms - would do well to focus more on issues that affect large portions of the country rather than trying to solve problems most people didn’t realize or believe exist. For example, every video of woke kids protesting a speaker at a college loses many potential voters. The image of the party is tainted.

If I was running the party, I’d do everything I could to shift that image back to the party of the working class. Every policy would be framed as: we’re improving the lives of people who go to work every day. Healthcare reform, raising wages, economic safety net, lower taxes, improving public schools. Let the GOP run their scare tactics and claim $15 an hour will ruin America and turn us into a socialist country. It passed in Florida. It’s popular. Losing working class voters to the Republicans is an abject failure and heads should role at the DNC.
 
“Figuring out how to scare people into believing change is bad and will affect them negatively is easy” and it’s even easier if “woke kids” can’t counter them in the public square.
 
I certainly don’t blame the Democrats for Trump. They had a primary, and he beat the “best” their party had to offer. The issue with Democrats and messaging has to start with the understanding that Democrats have a much harder job to do. Figuring out how to progress and improve lives is hard, and convincing people your plan will work is harder. Figuring out how to scare people into believing change is bad and will affect them negatively is easy. It’s kind of like being the defense lawyer in a civil case. At the end of the day, even if you have nothing, you can sit back and say “prove it.”

With that hill to climb, Democrats - and I don’t just mean the politicians, I mean everyone advocating for progressive reforms - would do well to focus more on issues that affect large portions of the country rather than trying to solve problems most people didn’t realize or believe exist. For example, every video of woke kids protesting a speaker at a college loses many potential voters. The image of the party is tainted.

If I was running the party, I’d do everything I could to shift that image back to the party of the working class. Every policy would be framed as: we’re improving the lives of people who go to work every day. Healthcare reform, raising wages, economic safety net, lower taxes, improving public schools. Let the GOP run their scare tactics and claim $15 an hour will ruin America and turn us into a socialist country. It passed in Florida. It’s popular. Losing working class voters to the Republicans is an abject failure and heads should role at the DNC.

If "woke kids" bothers somebody more than their paycheck and health insurance sucking, then they are worried about the wrong things.
 
we don't want white males


Pretty sure there are lots of cisgender white males, even former Republicans, who fell comfortable amidst Democrats.

Most likely it’s something else making someone feel unwelcome.
 
Figuring out how to scare people into believing change is bad and will affect them negatively is easy.


Yep.

Utterly dishonest reactionary fear mongering became over time pretty much the Republican brand. Thus the natural rise of an idiotic scoundrel of a conman like Trump.


It is an easier approach to political power than trying to make positive change happen. So, it’s true that a party caring to try to honestly effect positive change has the more difficult task. And that this would be the only party generally worthy of support “down the ballot” by good and discerning people.
 
If "woke kids" bothers somebody more than their paycheck and health insurance sucking, then they are worried about the wrong things.

I didn’t say it’s right. We all know many trump voters are voting against their own economic interests. The question is why. And dismissing it as “they’re stupid or racist” isn’t good enough. I want to win, and that’s not cutting it.
 
My woke kids comment is reserved for the illiberal practice of throwing a tantrum because a speaker doesn’t agree with you. The democrats should embrace being the party of free speech and diversity of thought. The guy at the factory in Michigan doesn’t see them that way when 19 year olds at Cal are spending their time trying to remove a speaker for once tweeting something that they disagree with.
 
My woke kids comment is reserved for the illiberal practice of throwing a tantrum because a speaker doesn’t agree with you. The democrats should embrace being the party of free speech and diversity of thought. The guy at the factory in Michigan doesn’t see them that way when 19 year olds at Cal are spending their time trying to remove a speaker for once tweeting something that they disagree with.

so he instead wants to vote for the party where 25-30 year olds carry tiki torches and chant "Jews will not replace us"?

You're extrapolating the behavior of a few to the party as a whole. The republicans have stupid shit on their side that is way worse than woke 19 year olds.
 
Back to my original point. The Democrats have a harder job. And he’s not voting for the tiki nazis, he’s voting for the guy telling him how dangerous the Democrats are. Which is why the messaging must improve, and must always go back to helping improve the lives of people who go to work every day and are struggling.
 
I’m so over these former republican “centrist” ass voters blaming the democrats for not doing more to stop the Republican Party from voting in a racist autocratic piece of shit. How about we blame the republicans for that. Personal responsibility and everything.

Ah, the bkf explanation for Trumpism - it's all the Democratic Party's fault. If only Democrats nominated candidates that adopted GOP positions on pretty much everything, and stopped calling out Republicans whenever they say or do things that are clearly racist or sexist or homophobic or otherwise terrible, then maybe they might have two "good" choices to choose from and might - just might - vote for the Democrat! Really!
 
My woke kids comment is reserved for the illiberal practice of throwing a tantrum because a speaker doesn’t agree with you. The democrats should embrace being the party of free speech and diversity of thought. The guy at the factory in Michigan doesn’t see them that way when 19 year olds at Cal are spending their time trying to remove a speaker for once tweeting something that they disagree with.

I would argue that the Democrats do have far more diversity of thought and free speech, as witness the spectrum from AOC to Chuck Schumer to Omar to Roy Cooper. It's the Republicans who increasingly act like lemmings and stifle anyone who dares to criticize Trump. If a blue-collar worker in Michigan gets bent out of shape because he sees some college kid from CA on Fox News or OAN or Brietbart or whatever trying to "silence" a speaker, then I'm not sure what Democrats can do about it. Stifle the rights of college kids around the country to protest a speaker they don't agree with? Fox has been brilliant at this type of thing - they're remarkable at finding some anonymous instructor at Podunk Community College somewhere who has said that Republicans are rednecks who shouldn't be allowed to vote, and then pretending that this nut speaks for all liberals everywhere. It's very difficult to combat that.
 
I mean, we literally have left wing posters here who have a problem with jokes that Dave Chappelle, a comedian who is also fighting the good fight, told during a comedy show. I totally agree there is great diversity of thought within the party. I also think we need to cut out some of the purity tests.

Nothing compares to trumpism, which is a cult with its own leader, beliefs, and “information.”
 
I mean, we literally have left wing posters here who have a problem with jokes that Dave Chappelle, a comedian who is also fighting the good fight, told during a comedy show. I totally agree there is great diversity of thought within the party. I also think we need to cut out some of the purity tests.

Nothing compares to trumpism, which is a cult with its own leader, beliefs, and “information.”

Even if a comedian is “fighting the good fight” it still sucks to punch down at marginalized communities.

Asking that someone not be transphobic is not a “purity test”, it’s a pretty fucking low bar to clear.
 
Keep fighting against jokes while the opposition laughs and convinces rube nation youre more focused on genitals than their paychecks.
 
I mean, we literally have left wing posters here who have a problem with jokes that Dave Chappelle, a comedian who is also fighting the good fight, told during a comedy show. I totally agree there is great diversity of thought within the party. I also think we need to cut out some of the purity tests.

Nothing compares to trumpism, which is a cult with its own leader, beliefs, and “information.”

I get what you're saying, but I don't think the problem is nearly as bad in the Democratic Party as the Republican, and I'm not sure what one can do stop some people from getting pissed off and ranting about it, especially on message boards. Telling them to shut up certainly won't work, driving them out of the party for complaining is a bad idea, and message boards are always going to have people complaining about something, and "purity tests" have been around in American politics since the Salem Witch Trials. I don't like them either, all I'm saying that it's a part of human nature and that I'm not sure there's any real way to stop it in either party. And right-wing media is always going to amplify anything any Democrat says to drive a further wedge between the GOP base and Democrats.
 
Keep fighting against jokes while the opposition laughs and convinces rube nation youre more focused on genitals than their paychecks.

What the hell are you talking about dude? Dave Chappell doesn’t need you to white Knight in his defense. It’s possible to hold more than one thought in your head. Me saying “it sucks to make those jokes” is not the same as “this should be the Party’s national message”
 
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