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Official 2020-21 NBA Finals - Milwaukee Bucks win the NBA Championship!

Looks like Lowry will either be a 76er or in Miami. Norm Powell likely on the move too.
 
I'm seeing the Heat are looking at probably giving up Dragic and one of Robinson or Herro to get Lowry

I'm not sure about that move, but Pat Riley is hard to doubt
 
Collins got the full article treatment in the Ringer: https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/22/22343534/john-collins-atlanta-hawks-trade-deadline

pretty much a well-written, stats-heavy account of our boards debate:

The nine-figure question, though, is whether a roughly top-50 player—one who’s just 23 years old, has improved since getting drafted, and could stand to get even better—is attractive enough to entice teams to both part with young talent and draft capital to acquire him and offer him a max-level salary in free agency. For teams in bigger markets, with grander aims, or with more specifically, defensive needs at the 4—the Celtics, say, or the Trail Blazers—Collins might not move the needle enough to be worth the price. Other teams, though, might have a different answer.

Ultimately, it comes down to how good you think Collins is now and can be in the future. If he’s your second- or third-best player, can you be a real title contender? And if he’s your fourth or fifth best, how could you pay Atlanta what it wants for him and pay him what he’ll be looking for this offseason?
 
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Yeah, the Heat podcast I listen to said Robinson is likely gone, probably Kelly O too if they get just Lowry. Didn't say anything about Goran getting moved but makes sense given his contract. Herro likely on the table if they get Powell too. Bam, Jimmy, and Kyle all apparently are friends so will be interesting to see how much Jimmy pushes the issue.

While I'm more bullish on Herro than most, the central ? is will he really be a star in the next two years or will his ceiling be the 3rd best player on any given team? We'll see what Riley thinks this week.

Heat could go from a team with a supporting cast of sharpshooters to one of LMA (Spurs buyout), Lowry, and Powell in a week.
 
TownieDeac said:
I meant it went Duncan, Paul, Collins

Though I’d see arguments otherwise
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John Collins is very good, no doubt but:

Josh Howard

NBA all star
NBA championship team as a starter (Mavs went 23-0 when Howard scored 20 pts.)
Howard turned down Jerry Colangelo’s offer to play for team USA in the 2008 Olympics

1st Team All American AP and plenty more
ACC POY unanimous, first time since David Thompson 1975
First Team All ACC
First Team All ACC defense
WF finished first in regular season his SR year, first outright for Deacs in 41 years
Finalist for National Player of the year Wooden Award
Finalist for National Player of the year Naismith Award
No. 5 jersey retired by Wake Forest

So, it is sort of like Duncan then a clear 2 and 3 Paul and Howard then...what has Collins really done other than a lot of double doubles, which truly are impressive, and some sweet dunks. Time will tell...
 
DeaconBrews said:
Shams has the Hornets as buyers at the trade deadline, looking at richaun holmes
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He says that after LaMelo's injury? That doesn't make much sense, Holmes is a UFA after this season. Why would they give up something to rent him for a few months in a season that now has a pretty set ceiling?
 
DeaconBrews said:
Yeah, the Heat podcast I listen to said Robinson is likely gone, probably Kelly O too if they get just Lowry. Didn't say anything about Goran getting moved but makes sense given his contract. Herro likely on the table if they get Powell too. Bam, Jimmy, and Kyle all apparently are friends so will be interesting to see how much Jimmy pushes the issue.

While I'm more bullish on Herro than most, the central ? is will he really be a star in the next two years or will his ceiling be the 3rd best player on any given team? We'll see what Riley thinks this week.

Heat could go from a team with a supporting cast of sharpshooters to one of LMA (Spurs buyout), Lowry, and Powell in a week.
Click to expand...

right, I think Goran has to get moved to match contracts (not sure who else would fit the criteria that is reasonably on the table), plus it relieves some of the logjam in the backcourt

all signs point to Robinson commanding more money than the Heat want to spend, so makes sense to move him, but also really hurts this year in their pursuit of another run -- homie can shoot and plays hard

if Powell comes back too, I think that changes a lot
 
good thing about Lamelo is that -- to my knowledge -- wrist issues aren't career-lingering issues
 
I'm sure shutting him down would be more precautionary than anything. He played for a while after he broke it and generally seemed fine other than holding it from time to time.
 
JuiceCrewAllStar said:
Collins got the full article treatment in the Ringer: https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/22/22343534/john-collins-atlanta-hawks-trade-deadline

pretty much a well-written, stats-heavy account of our boards debate:

The nine-figure question, though, is whether a roughly top-50 player—one who’s just 23 years old, has improved since getting drafted, and could stand to get even better—is attractive enough to entice teams to both part with young talent and draft capital to acquire him and offer him a max-level salary in free agency. For teams in bigger markets, with grander aims, or with more specifically, defensive needs at the 4—the Celtics, say, or the Trail Blazers—Collins might not move the needle enough to be worth the price. Other teams, though, might have a different answer.

Ultimately, it comes down to how good you think Collins is now and can be in the future. If he’s your second- or third-best player, can you be a real title contender? And if he’s your fourth or fifth best, how could you pay Atlanta what it wants for him and pay him what he’ll be looking for this offseason?
Click to expand...

Pretty good article, the stats on Collins are always fascinating to me. Such as: "The list of players averaging as many points and rebounds per game this season as Collins, while also posting an effective field goal percentage (which accounts for 3-pointers being worth more than 2-pointers) as high as Collins, is two names long: Nikola Jokic and Giannis Antetokounmpo."

I think I agree with the conclusion that he's unlikely to be moved this deadline. What happens in RFA will certainly be interesting though. If the Hawks truly aren't willing to sign him to the big contract, I'll be (1) disappointed about that and (2) pretty annoyed that the Hawks tipped their hand so early on that that was the case.
 
Official 2020-21 NBA Season Thread - LaMelo out for the year

Enjoyed the Collins article. Good to see our debate among random schmoes (albeit ones who have followed Collins the longest) turned up the same conclusions as a well sourced analysis.

Sure there are questions but I’ll say the same thing I said about the Tatum contract. You’ve got to pay to find out. I just don’t see the point of tanking to draft a bunch of young talent and not pay the guys who pan out.

JuiceCrewAllStar said:
Stockton's steals record feels almost as untouchable as his assist record

Gretzky-type untouchability
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I’ve always thought Stockton was the best comp for CP and that CP is the best PG of his generation. Goes to show just how good Stockton was.
 
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deacon14 said:
Pretty good article, the stats on Collins are always fascinating to me. Such as: "The list of players averaging as many points and rebounds per game this season as Collins, while also posting an effective field goal percentage (which accounts for 3-pointers being worth more than 2-pointers) as high as Collins, is two names long: Nikola Jokic and Giannis Antetokounmpo."
Click to expand...

the difference, of course, is substantially different usage rates
 
JuiceCrewAllStar said:
the difference, of course, is substantially different usage rates
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Well yeah, thought that didn't need to be explained. Remarkably high efficiency is still valuable though, especially as a big that shoots 3s. The counterargument being that he is so efficient because he is often not having to create his own shot, although that's an area he's improved significantly in recent seasons.
 
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Of course there are plenty of players who don’t have to create their own shot who don’t put up numbers similar to Jokic and Giannis.
 
LOL. That's a great nickname.
 
Hawks were up 20+ at the Clips in the 3rd. Bob and Nique were talking all kinds of shit in the commentary. Luke Kennard and Terrance Mann went off in the 3rd and got it close. Now the Clips are up 8 with under 2 left. Horrible collapse.

D14, you OK?
 
PhDeac said:
Hawks were up 20+ at the Clips in the 3rd. Bob and Nique were talking all kinds of shit in the commentary. Luke Kennard and Terrance Mann went off in the 3rd and got it close. Now the Clips are up 8 with under 2 left. Horrible collapse.

D14, you OK?
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Luke Kennard with the 8-8 from the field for 20 pounds. I can't remember seeing that in a box score before.

Hawks seem fucked given their 2 highest salaried dudes are playing 20 minutes per game off the bench. One is a 32 year old Gallinari, and the other is a 33% 3pt Shooting Guard Bogdanovic. Does this situation improve in the future? Us as deacs should hope Collins gets traded.
 
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