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Cancel culture & Wingate Hall

I should have chimed in initially to say that this is pretty rad and I would be proud to have graduated from an institution that went through this process and arrived at this solution. I'm proud to cheer for student-athletes representing that institution.
 
At the risk of repeating myself over and over, I do not agree that it is racist to notice a trend and express angst and dismay at that phenomena. In my opinion, if a professor notices a trend of black students doing worse than white students and ignores it, they would be implying that it is to be expected or normal. In other words, not discussing this would be worse.

As to the investigation, why can't Georgetown simply compare grades given in this class to other similarly-graded courses? I'm sure that we would all want to know that information before calling for their careers to be ended.

They give the grades. They did not notice a trend. They caused the trend. And they said this while grading a Black student so you can’t say they observed this independent of the grading process.
 
Welcome back, Strick.

At the risk of repeating myself over and over, I do not agree that it is racist to notice a trend and express angst and dismay at that phenomena. In my opinion, if a professor notices a trend of black students doing worse than white students and ignores it, they would be implying that it is to be expected or normal. In other words, not discussing this would be worse.

As to the investigation, why can't Georgetown simply compare grades given in this class to other similarly-graded courses? I'm sure that we would all want to know that information before calling for their careers to be ended.

The professors give the grades to a subjective assignment. They did not notice a trend. They caused the trend. And they said this while grading a Black student so you can’t say they made an observation independent of the grading process.
 
If a professor is noticing a "trend" that they, and they alone (as far as they are aware), are giving worse grades to black students in a subjective course where the grades are based in large part on class participation, it's probably a time for introspection rather than blaming an entire race, other than the "really good ones". Sorry, but as soon as that came out of her mouth it was game over.

Shouldn't have to educate lawyers on this thread that a private company's investigation and decision to terminate its employers does not need to go full Benghazi.
 
You don't know whether it was subjective, or the extent to which grades were subjective. I think you're making an assumption because it's the only way this can fit your narrative. The transcript indicates that the professors were tracking "did they open their mouths." That is objective. We've discussed sterotype threat, which would fit that scenario as a reasonable explanation.
 
You don't know whether it was subjective, or the extent to which grades were subjective. I think you're making an assumption because it's the only way this can fit your narrative. The transcript indicates that the professors were tracking "did they open their mouths." That is objective. We've discussed sterotype threat, which would fit that scenario as a reasonable explanation.

I thought we knew that 25% of the grade was based on participation? That's a lot of grade determined subjectively by people who notice a trend but don't hold themselves accountable at all for this trend (despite the fact that they are teachers and graders of the students whose grades constitute the trend).
 
I think there's an important distinction to be made here between "grades" and "performance". Both are subjectively evaluated but they are not the same.

The discussion here seems to be focused on grades. If the professors are indeed lamenting poor grades "earned" by black students then they are ignoring their own subjective role in evaluating performance and determining grades.
 
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You don't know whether it was subjective, or the extent to which grades were subjective. I think you're making an assumption because it's the only way this can fit your narrative. The transcript indicates that the professors were tracking "did they open their mouths." That is objective. We've discussed sterotype threat, which would fit that scenario as a reasonable explanation.

No, I read the following:

"Another third-year student pointed out that Sellers and Batson’s class was a participation-based course, “making Black students particularly susceptible to biased grading” given Sellers’ racist views. A quarter of the final grade is based on “pure class participation,” a highly subjective criterion that gives professors broad latitude to inject their personal prejudices into the grading process. Alarmingly, Sellers made her statement while she and Batson were evaluating a Black student’s performance in class."

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/03/georgetown-law-professor-racist-remarks-sandra-sellers-black-students.html

While completely unnecessary for reasons discussed, I would love to see the objective records of class participation grades given based on "did they open their mouths" - I'm sure that actually happened.
 
the prof. was literally counting the times law students 'opened their mouths' and using that for grading purposes? for law school?
 
Having taught my entire career at state schools and a community college, I've dealt with lots of underprepared students, especially at the lower level. It's not their fault, of course, that they're coming from backgrounds and high schools that haven't adequately prepared them for what they will face in college.

There are important conversations to be had about the problems they face and the extra attention they require from faculty and staff. But they are there for a reason and studies show that with a little extra attention (especially from focused programs for first-gen or minority students) these students succeed at an impressive rate.

Again, I think there's a legitimate conversation to be had about students showing up to law school underprepared for coursework, but a professor that's willing to dismiss all students of a particular background or level of experience is not doing so out of a desire to help these students.
 
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the prof. was literally counting the times law students 'opened their mouths' and using that for grading purposes? for law school?

I have experienced this, and so did my wife. It is stupid and it encourages the most insufferable kids to be as insufferable as possible.

We clearly need more information about the metrics and methods used to evaluate and grade students in this class. It's almost like an investigation would be helpful.
 
i don't think so, i think we've already solved this puzzle. pretty obviously.

but yeah, performance tracking in higher ed probably needs an investigation
 
The whole idea of law school participation is the Socratic method, where the professor cold calls randomly so everyone makes sure they are fully prepared. That was my experience and I don't recall that any of my grades were based on participation. And my bad ass got the highest grade in my torts and negotiations classes.
 
They give the grades. They did not notice a trend. They caused the trend. And they said this while grading a Black student so you can’t say they observed this independent of the grading process.

Every law school exam I ever took was graded blind.
 
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