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Mt. Tabor High Shooting

I can't really figure it out, to be honest. I think an extremely small percentage of gun owners have the same extreme views that the NRA fights for and they donate to the NRA. I think an additional small percentage of gun owners do not agree with all of the NRA positions but still donate because they agree with SOME of the NRA positions and wish that the NRA would pull back from the extreme but don't have any power to make that happen. Those donations provide the NRA with enough money to push their agenda - which, over time and under the influence of a lot of paranoia, has gotten more and more extreme. My father was an NRA member decades ago but I don't think he ever really knew what they did. I have never been a member.

But that is just a theory I came up with off the top of my head. I really don't know. I do know we have a lot of spineless leaders in government who talk a lot but who quickly swing in whatever direction they believe will keep them in office.

For one, I think you are probably undervaluing the percentage of gun owners that fully support the NRA's stance on preventing any sort of reasonable gun ownership regulations. As far as the rest of it, I more or less am on the same page as you. There's a lot of gun owners that believe stricter gun ownership policies would be good for society, but want to keep their guns so bad that they certainly aren't going to take any action to make that happen and may even continue donating to the NRA.

Actions speak louder than words, and there's a lot more gun owners that say they want better gun laws and then do nothing about it than gun owners that want better gun laws and are actually willing to pursue changes to make that happen.
 
Same tired arguments. The reality is more guns, more gun deaths. Full stop.

This is absolutely correct. More guns, more gun violence. It completely makes sense and is completely supported by the data.
 
I can't really figure it out, to be honest. I think an extremely small percentage of gun owners have the same extreme views that the NRA fights for and they donate to the NRA. I think an additional small percentage of gun owners do not agree with all of the NRA positions but still donate because they agree with SOME of the NRA positions and wish that the NRA would pull back from the extreme but don't have any power to make that happen. Those donations provide the NRA with enough money to push their agenda - which, over time and under the influence of a lot of paranoia, has gotten more and more extreme. My father was an NRA member decades ago but I don't think he ever really knew what they did. I have never been a member.

But that is just a theory I came up with off the top of my head. I really don't know. I do know we have a lot of spineless leaders in government who talk a lot but who quickly swing in whatever direction they believe will keep them in office.

Because “gun policy” is not really about guns anymore. It’s a cultural wedge issue to drive fear and voter turnout, consequences be damned.
 
the NRA is mostly funded by the gun industry, they really don't care about random Joes paying for whatever the annual membership costs. I used to work for an animal charity and sure we had little old ladies donating 10 bucks a month but we were depending on the big corporate and foundation gifts.
 
LOL. I'd take out a rabid racoon with a shovel in a heartbeat. Actually, I'd probably use a pitchfork, but you get the idea.

Could you kill a rabid racoon with a shovel? This is where the debate needs to go at this point.
 
Could you kill a rabid racoon with a shovel? This is where the debate needs to go at this point.

I'd just drop an elbow from the top rope on that striped bastard with shifty eyes. Why the mask, racoon? WHAT ARE YOU HIDING
 
Rafi must provide evidence of him killing a raccoon with a shovel by the end of the week or he is a phony!
 
You and I aren't going to agree on mag. cap limits.

I also believe that if you've served in the military, or can prove through substantial background and competency check, that you should be allowed to own an automatic firearm.


I'm interested to hear you expound on why you think high capacity magazines and automatic weapons (under your strange, limited exemption) are hands off?
 
I realize that the situation in Afghanistan is distinguishable on some points (distance, sanctuary, will to fight, etc.), but do folks here not see how an armed resistance is capable of not only holding our military at bay, but winning a war of attrition over a period of years?

If you take all the guns away from the Taliban, do you guys not think the outcome is different? Don't underestimate yourselves, and don't over-estimate our military-capability (or inappropriately think that our police/populace/military is a monolith).
 
Why do you responsible gun owners feel the need to weigh in every time this happens? To hear you tell it, NONE of you are gun nuts. Guess what? Some of you and your family and friends are. If you own multiple guns for each member of your family, YOU'RE A GUN NUT. If you don't like it, DON'T HAVE SO MANY GUNS. You're going to now argue with me about this, which proves that you're a GUN NUT.

You gun owners keep telling yourselves you're responsible and that you're not the problem, even while ON THIS THREAD where we should be mourning the loss of youth lives, you can't STFU long enough to let that happen. Instead you're here defending responsible gun owners. You "responsible gun owners" are the ones contributing hundreds of millions of dollars to the NRA annually, and I don't give two shits that membership is down or that you personally quit contributing. Your former donations and your friends created the monster, and now our leaders won't pass even the reasonable gun control laws that some of you support, because the NRA will effectively take their job away if they breathe a word about waiting periods or background checks.

Look, we all are coming to grips that nothing is going to change, no matter how many people or even kids die so that you can continue to be responsible. So if you're a responsible gun owner, just shut the fuck up for a day and let us mourn that kids are getting killed because you and your family and friends won't let us have reasonable gun control laws in this country. You're going to get your way and nothing will change, and you'll get to continue telling yourself how responsible you are. Let the rest of us fantasize about a world where violence isn't embraced and glorified, and where people actually care enough about each other to lay their weapons down. I am an anti-gun nut and fucking proud of the fact that I will face God knowing that I spoke out to keep His people safe. I sleep great at night knowing that guns are dangerous and that millions of people are terrorized with them annually, and that I speak out against them. I honestly don't know how Christian gun owners, even the responsible ones, have talked themselves into believing that Jesus would condone their gun ownership. Don't tell me - I'm not interested in a discussion about it because you're wrong. I'm sure you can rationalize it away all day long, but that's all it will ever be - rationalization. Sleep on that.

While I generally agree with your overall sentiment, and do believe today would be a great day for gun owners to let people mourn however they feel appropriate, it's just not nearly this simple. I do know several gun owners who do not belong to the NRA, are 100% fine with background checks, are fine limiting how many guns one can own, and support banning assault rifles. To lump them all together is just as silly as owning tons of guns.
 
What type of government overreach does gun ownership prevent? If the police come to your home to take your stuff, having a gun just legitimizes their overreach. Does having a gun lower your taxes? It's a nonsense argument.

Stealing elections.
 
While I generally agree with your overall sentiment, and do believe today would be a great day for gun owners to let people mourn however they feel appropriate, it's just not nearly this simple. I do know several gun owners who do not belong to the NRA, are 100% fine with background checks, are fine limiting how many guns one can own, and support banning assault rifles. To lump them all together is just as silly as owning tons of guns.

Can you explain how/why it matters how many guns someone owns?

This the argument that I just don't understand. You can't effectively use more than one gun at a time. Why is everyone so bent out of shape about owning more than one?
 
I realize that the situation in Afghanistan is distinguishable on some points (distance, sanctuary, will to fight, etc.), but do folks here not see how an armed resistance is capable of not only holding our military at bay, but winning a war of attrition over a period of years?

If you take all the guns away from the Taliban, do you guys not think the outcome is different? Don't underestimate yourselves, and don't over-estimate our military-capability (or inappropriately think that our police/populace/military is a monolith).

is this in reference to your gun ownership limits government overreach arg?
 
I personally think that the rabid racoon would take out about 9/10's of the board, tbh.
 
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